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carrying without a permit


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72 replies to this topic

#41 Hershmeister

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Posted 01 July 2013 - 06:42 PM

Taken with a grain of salt (as I don't have first-hand experience), I've heard that a side-benefit of having a permit is that it might start you off in better standing with an officer if you're detained for questioning on something. The rational given was that an officer can quickly determine that you're an upstanding citizen with no felonies or other major criminal issues. If it's a situation where the officer has discretion, they might decide to give you a verbal warning instead of a citation.


I wouldn't assume that an HCP holder is automatically a "good guy" if I were an LEO. The HCP only proves at the moment it was issued you were "ok". Anything can happen after its issuance is

#42 monkeylizard

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Posted 01 July 2013 - 08:38 PM

Add in that LEOs are people too with their own varying opinions, and you'll find that some don't like non-LEOs having permits.I doubt that's as common as the pro-permit LEO opinion, but you never know the personal opinion of the person that pulled you over.


Edited by monkeylizard, 01 July 2013 - 08:38 PM.

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#43 Oh Shoot

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Posted 01 July 2013 - 09:48 PM

...

You will be arrested and charged for the violation.

 

Maybe. Might only be issued a summons, especially if it's Class C violation.

 

Gun will be taken in any case, though.

 

- OS


Edited by Oh Shoot, 01 July 2013 - 09:48 PM.

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#44 Jesse

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 02:12 PM

I know many good people with guns in thier cars loaded ready to go. But they have no permits. These people have never been arrested for anything serious. Some not at all.

Theres more out there than you think.
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#45 Cruel Hand Luke

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 08:04 PM

And until something DOES happen ...nothing is going to happen.

 

Just because some other people drive around with a metric ton of marijuana, an unregistered machine gun and dead hookers  in THEIR car and never got caught does not mean it is a good idea for YOU to drive around with a metric ton of marijuana, an unregistered machine gun and dead hookers in YOUR car. It is still illegal and if you get caught with it the odds are absolutely overwhelming that you will end up with a criminal record and all the problems that brings with it..... 

 

Having said that, just remember ...in the real world you are still free to do ANYTHING you want....but Big Boy Rules apply. ANYTHING you choose to do can be done....but there are consequences. 

 

If you do it you have to be prepared to deal with the consequences...both the intended and unintended. Twenty years ago a cop in a rural area MIGHT give you the benefit of the doubt if found with a loaded gun and no permit.....but NOW, with the comparatively easy process to get "permission" from the state , anyone WITHOUT a permit carrying a loaded gun is looked at as a criminal first and will have a hard time avoiding the problems that come with that. 

 

Do what you wish....but be prepared for the worst. 


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#46 tnhawk

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 11:31 AM

I fail to see any good reason to carry without a permit, under the current laws. The risk of fines and jail/prison time outweigh the expense and time necessary to obtain and legallay carry. In the event I find it necessary to defend myself with a weapon, I'd prefer to stand before the judge and jury as a law abiding citizen instead of as one who ignores the laws.

#47 HvBikeWlTravel

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 12:41 PM

As Clod Stomper said, I too carried for years before TN issued permits. 

 

+1           

Amazing how quickly mindsets can be changed when Permits introduced into Law. Now everybody without a Permit is a Criminal if they carry????


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#48 HvBikeWlTravel

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 12:44 PM

Having said that, just remember ...in the real world you are still free to do ANYTHING you want....but Big Boy Rules apply. ANYTHING you choose to do can be done....but there are consequences. 

 

 

Big Boy Rules? Don't you mean GOVERNMENT Rules?



#49 Emtdaddy1980

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 02:28 PM

And until something DOES happen ...nothing is going to happen.

Just because some other people drive around with a metric ton of marijuana, an unregistered machine gun and dead hookers in THEIR car and never got caught does not mean it is a good idea for YOU to drive around with a metric ton of marijuana, an unregistered machine gun and dead hookers in YOUR car. It is still illegal and if you get caught with it the odds are absolutely overwhelming that you will end up with a criminal record and all the problems that brings with it.....

Having said that, just remember ...in the real world you are still free to do ANYTHING you want....but Big Boy Rules apply. ANYTHING you choose to do can be done....but there are consequences.

If you do it you have to be prepared to deal with the consequences...both the intended and unintended. Twenty years ago a cop in a rural area MIGHT give you the benefit of the doubt if found with a loaded gun and no permit.....but NOW, with the comparatively easy process to get "permission" from the state , anyone WITHOUT a permit carrying a loaded gun is looked at as a criminal first and will have a hard time avoiding the problems that come with that.

Do what you wish....but be prepared for the worst.



^^^^_ THIS +1
I've always tried to drill into my sons heads how important it is for your marijuana to be sub distribution weights, your machine guns legally registered and your STILL BREATHING hookers to be properly seated and restrained in accordance with the seatbelt laws.
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#50 East_TN_Patriot

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 06:39 PM

I new in advance that no one would admit that they do without a permit,  but as hammer swinger indicated to some the fees and intrusion in to some ones life seems to be going a little over board with the government these days.  As an example having been a Viet Nam era Vet, a former union worker and democrat I never thought I would change my thoughts or beliefs, but due to the current administration I have changed a lot of my thinking and will be changing my party affiliation.  

Considering that you are on the receiving end of policies back by Republicans and Democrats, perhaps the Libertarian Party would be worth a look.

However, to your original question, yes, people carry without a permit, and many people with permits carry in places they know they are not legally allowed to do so.  When government passes a law, it's only as good as the willingness of people to follow it, the ability and willingness of police to enforce it, and the willingness and ability of the court to prosecute it.  When government passes laws that many see as unjust (as a friend of mine stated in a post on a political blog we have, justice and legality are not necessarily the same thing) people will be far more likely to choose to ignore it.  As a disclaimer, I'm not suggesting that is necessarily a wise or legitimate way to handle it, but that is reality.


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#51 mikegideon

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 06:52 PM

Considering that you are on the receiving end of policies back by Republicans and Democrats, perhaps the Libertarian Party would be worth a look.

However, to your original question, yes, people carry without a permit, and many people with permits carry in places they know they are not legally allowed to do so.  When government passes a law, it's only as good as the willingness of people to follow it, the ability and willingness of police to enforce it, and the willingness and ability of the court to prosecute it.  When government passes laws that many see as unjust (as a friend of mine stated in a post on a political blog we have, justice and legality are not necessarily the same thing) people will be far more likely to choose to ignore it.  As a disclaimer, I'm not suggesting that is necessarily a wise or legitimate way to handle it, but that is reality.

 

ANY law is useless without enforcement. That's why so many ancient, ridiculous laws are still on the books. It's also why most current and future gun control laws won't work.



#52 confidence

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 08:24 PM

thinking to myself and was wondering if a lot of people will do, wither because they don't want to go through the trouble of getting the permit, or they don't want the state, feds etc to know all their business?  The bad guys do and don't care but I was wondering how many good guys do because of the above reasons, or some other reason, and what the consequences are. 

 

Ron

 

I have heard that there are lots of people in my area who carry without a permit.

 

I have an HCP and comply with the law because I don't feel like I have much of a choice. For those who posted that HCP=law abiding and no HCP=criminal: Remember, the 2nd Amendment is not what grants us the right to bear arms and neither does an HCP. The right to bear arms is a God given right that existed even before the Constitution ever existed. It's completely bogus that the government makes us get a permit to carry. Sure, I comply. But it's still ridiculous.


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#53 Cruel Hand Luke

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 11:18 PM

Big Boy Rules? Don't you mean GOVERNMENT Rules?

No...Government rules are...."Be a Good Boy and Obey"

 

Big boy rules are "Do whatever you like...but be prepared to deal with the consequences if the worst happens".


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#54 TMF

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 11:38 PM

^^^^_ THIS +1

I've always tried to drill into my sons heads how important it is for your marijuana to be sub distribution weights, your machine guns legally registered and your STILL BREATHING hookers to be properly seated and restrained in accordance with the seatbelt laws.


Parenting win right there. I hope you also explained to him not to show up anywhere with grass, hookers and machineguns unless he's willing to share.

#55 Cruel Hand Luke

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 11:41 PM

I have heard that there are lots of people in my area who carry without a permit.

 

I have an HCP and comply with the law because I don't feel like I have much of a choice. For those who posted that HCP=law abiding and no HCP=criminal: Remember, the 2nd Amendment is not what grants us the right to bear arms and neither does an HCP. The right to bear arms is a God given right that existed even before the Constitution ever existed. It's completely bogus that the government makes us get a permit to carry. Sure, I comply. But it's still ridiculous.

 

My own personal opinion is that the ability to arm and defend yourself is a basic human right not subject to government approval.........unfortunately the state of Tn does not agree with that and THEY are who will be prosecuting you if caught with a loaded and concealed gun. 

 

You can build a house without getting a building permit too.....but that won't go well for you either.  

 

As to whether someone who carries without a permit is a criminal....To clarify, I said that the powers that be tend to look at the armed person with no HCP as a criminal because since it is so easy to get one then why wouldn't you if you could legally? I have friends who work for local PD and they say THAT is the prevailing thought on the matter and as such if you get caught....you are going to get arrested. We may not LIKE that but reality is reality. Fire is hot whether we like it or not. My own personal feelings will not get me out of jail free and carrying without a permit is a game of Russian roulette....eventually you might get caught...so do what you want...just be prepared for the consequences.



#56 Ron Padilla

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Posted 05 July 2013 - 03:08 AM

Whoee I guess I kinda stirred up a hornets nest with this question, well keep em coming some have been very interesting.

#57 confidence

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Posted 05 July 2013 - 04:17 AM

My own personal opinion is that the ability to arm and defend yourself is a basic human right not subject to government approval.........unfortunately the state of Tn does not agree with that and THEY are who will be prosecuting you if caught with a loaded and concealed gun. 

 

You can build a house without getting a building permit too.....but that won't go well for you either.  

 

As to whether someone who carries without a permit is a criminal....To clarify, I said that the powers that be tend to look at the armed person with no HCP as a criminal because since it is so easy to get one then why wouldn't you if you could legally? I have friends who work for local PD and they say THAT is the prevailing thought on the matter and as such if you get caught....you are going to get arrested. We may not LIKE that but reality is reality. Fire is hot whether we like it or not. My own personal feelings will not get me out of jail free and carrying without a permit is a game of Russian roulette....eventually you might get caught...so do what you want...just be prepared for the consequences.

 

Which is why I have an HCP. Just ranting a bit about how ridiculous it is that the state of Tennessee requires it.



#58 Ron Padilla

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Posted 10 July 2013 - 05:24 AM

the saga has ended, with the state coming to their senses and issuing my permit, it should be here in a few days.

Thanks for all the replys

#59 Oh Shoot

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Posted 10 July 2013 - 05:30 AM

the saga has ended, with the state coming to their senses and issuing my permit, it should be here in a few days.

Thanks for all the replys

 

Outstanding. Thanks for keeping us tuned into the saga.

 

- OS



#60 TankerHC

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Posted 12 July 2013 - 04:27 AM

Fwiw, a friend of mine who was a therapist at a VA clinic says 90% of vietnam vets carry and illegally at VA Clinics. Even though none will admit a lot of older guys carry illegally everyday.

 

I can believe remote Clinics like the one in Chattanooga. But your not getting into a hospital or Regional Office armed with a metal toothpick. The primary cause of that, a patient in Jackson MS went into Sonny Montgomery several years ago (It was longer than that, I cant remember the year, but since I retired) and blew his doctors head off. Thats when the metal detectors went in. One of the best Doctors in the Hospital, friend of mine who is also a Doctor and worked with him as an intern told me recently he was one of the few who really cared about the Vets, didnt head for the parking lot at 4:59:30.