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Posts posted by DaveTN

  1. 31 minutes ago, gregintenn said:

    We simply can't afford to be all things to all people. I just cannot understand how I can support my family yet others cannot. There isn't anything special whatsoever about me. I live with the choices I've made. I expect others to do the same. Is that asking too much?

    I don’t think its asking too much. But as you can see, there is a very large percentage of the population that thinks they should have what those of us that have earned our own way have. Those people are socialists and have very good chance of taking over Congress and destroying our country. Sometime after the election we will know for sure, at least for the next four years. No, there is nothing right or fair about it. It’s been posted here before and I remember hearing it constantly as a young man that the Communists said they will take this country without firing a shot. I used to laugh that off. I’m not laughing now; you are watching a very good attempt. Only the voters can stop it.

    • Like 1

  2. 20 minutes ago, gregintenn said:

    The government now dictates what plans can and cannot be sold. Do you realize that you and I are paying for things we don’t need such as maternity coverage? Insurance companies cannot sell across state lines. There are many more examples.

    Without all of this type regulation, insurance companies would be much more competitive.

    Maybe. But that helps the working class that can pay the premiums. What about the working poor and those living off the government? Don’t get me wrong, I’ve not turned into nice guy. But those people are electing democrats because they are making a lot of noise about providing free quality health care for them. And if Biden gets elected I suspect that may well happen. Not only will you being paying for that in your insurance premiums, but your income taxes and property taxes are going to sky rocket. Jobs will be lost, further increasing your “share”.

  3. 5 minutes ago, alleycat72 said:

    When I die, her part will convert to 100% until her death. 

    So the two of you together will get 149% (your pension and her getting an additional 49%) and when you die hers goes to 100%? Is that better than her drawing SS? I'm just curious because I have never heard of anything like this, and would like to understand it. Is your pension government? 

  4. 16 minutes ago, alleycat72 said:

    She has to choose SS or my plan at retirement. She'll choose my plan and her contributions will be rolled into my retirement. At that point she'll get 49% of what I receive.

    So she will get benefits from what she paid? What you are doing is a choice, right? So I assume that will give her more money, and will continue if you die before her?

  5. 13 minutes ago, gregintenn said:

    The way to fix it is to remove government interference and let the free market do what it does. I know...good luck getting that done.

    How is the free market not doing its job now? I think you can see from what’s going on now you can’t tell the poor to “get a job”. In a free market, the insurance companies will charge you whatever they like. Is that not what’s happening now? How will that help the people on this forum that say their rates are ridiculous, or that they can’t afford insurance?

    • Like 1

  6. 13 hours ago, gregintenn said:

    Dave, I trust you realize government created this problem. You have more faith than I do if you expect them to fix it.

    I don’t trust the government. How else is it going to get fixed? I’m not arguing; that’s a question. Doing nothing means the working stiffs continue to pay monthly premiums that are crazy.

  7. 9 hours ago, Yuri Orlov said:

    My question is does the new Concealed Only permit require fingerprinting or just a name only background check every 5 years?  I have read conflicting information in regards to fingerprinting and the concealed only permit.  


    The CCP permit requires fingerprinting when you apply, then it’s a name only background check every five years.


    • Like 1

  8. 58 minutes ago, gregintenn said:

    The medical industry went off the reservation when consumers were disconnected from the price of the product/service. Call a hospital and ask how much they'd charge to remove your gall bladder. They wouldn't have a clue. I know of no other industry that operates this way.

    Another problem we've run into is the cold, hard fact that we have the ability to do more things than we can afford to do. We all love our families, but is it economically sustainable to do a million dollars worth of medical procedures to granny who is 95 and doesn't even know where she's at? Is it really even doing her any favors regardless of who pays the bill? These are some tough questions that will soon have to be answered.

    I understand the emotional side of making all healthcare available to everyone, but it simply does not work on a calculator.

    I do know that an ever increasing tax burden on the working folks of this country isn't the way to solve it.

    I also know that a lot of folks will go to the doctor or emergency room when it isn't necessary as long as there isn't a cost to them. Make them pay a few hundred bucks, and they will discover alternative measures to deal with whatever ails them.

    There are a lot of problems to deal with. You are willing to play God based on a calculator. And that may have to be the case, but many in Congress aren’t willing to do that.

    Lets say that’s not Grandma, but its your 35 year old wife who was healthy and without warning just dropped from a brain aneurysm. The Doctors don’t think she will survive, but they don’t know that for sure. You have two young daughters to raise. Keeping her alive will bankrupt your family in short order. But if you have government insurance that will pay it, you will wait and see. Who plays God, the government health care provider??

    Or your daughter has a rare condition that is usually fatal. But she is on a wonder drug that costs $35K a year, and is keeping her alive and leading a somewhat normal life. What if the government won’t pay it? And if they didn’t pay it, would drugs like those exist.

    I don’t have the answers, I’m just throwing out that its not all cut and dried. I don’t think illegals should have free health care at our expense, but it appears half the country does not agree.

    Yes, people should not be allowed to go to the ER for non emergency situations. But many go for emergency care, car wrecks, heart attacks, shooting, etc. Many aren’t going to pay; they can’t. But they are going to be treated.

    There is a lot to work out. But I like to believe that like with problems in industry, if the leaders (Congress) were forced to work with Doctors and other professionals to work out a resolution; they could. Will everyone be happy with the results? Highly doubtful.

  9. I think both sides want a health care plan that will work. All anyone has to do is say how their plan will work, who will be covered, and how it will be paid for. So far, those are big stumbling blocks. The biggest stumbling blocks I see right now is health care or illegals, and everyone having the same level of care, whether they work or not. Some are going to see any amount being paid as too much. Also, some here are talking like Medicare is free. Medicare isn’t free and if you want full coverage it can get pretty pricey for someone in retirement.

    One of the things I don’t see too often is the discussion out the exorbitant rates charged in the medical industry. If it’s a government plan for everyone; they will be sitting the rates for what they will pay a Doctor or a hospital, and private insurance will be gone. That will also mean a lot of jobs lost, other than those absorbed into government positions.

  10. Carrying a gun is a constitutional right and a natural right, even though this state doesn’t see it that way. It is a persons own responsibility to be trained to deal with a deadly force situation. The CCP was put in place for those that can’t afford training. The HCP class is not a training class and many can’t afford real training classes that runs hundreds of dollars for the class and ammo. But many of them can still get trained by friends or family. They have the personal responsibility to get trained, and we have no idea how many do.

    Are untrained people shooting others a big problem? I don’t know. I know that many instances of bad shoots or negligent shootings come from those that have been trained. Again, its what the number crunchers desire the numbers to show.

    My thoughts come from my experience of dealing with the victims of violence that needed the immediate ability to carry a gun, in a state that would not allow that, trained or not.

    • Like 6
    • Thanks 1

  11. We are locked in on numbers. Numbers only give you a true representation if they are legitimate. Like firearms involved in violence, the numbers can be manipulated to show whatever you like. I don’t believe that the people crunching the numbers are trustworthy.

    I don’t put much stock in testing numbers, other than to realize that as the number of tests go up, so will the number of cases. Also, plenty of people test positive that never even have and symptoms.

    The number of deaths would be a real indicator. But it appears that deaths that are not from Covid are being added.

    Like a loaded gun, I understand this is dangerous. But also, like a loaded gun, I suspect those using reasonable safety precautions are at far lower risk.

    • Like 1

  12. 11 hours ago, TomInMN said:

    Couple scenarios:

    1. Some bad folks are breaking into your house, obviously you don't get to shoot the clueless wonders passing by on the sidewalk. They're not culpable for the crime.

    2. Couple guys are driving around and pull into a gas station so one can go in and buy cigarettes. He comes out having just robbed and killed the clerk, he gets in the car and they drive away. The other had no knowledge that happened and yet is still legally culpable.

    So, back to our escaping a violent crowd scenario, can you run over people who were more or less minding their own business, since they're (purposely or not) contributing to someone breaching your car?

    The guy driving the car at the store isn’t guilty of anything. Not unless a jury believes beyond reasonable doubt that he had knowledge, either before the incident or helping in the getaway. I’m not sure what you want to charge him with that doesn’t require intent or state of mind?

    Sure, you can run over the protestors. But if you injure innocent people you are likely to stand trial. It also depends on what the level of violence is and the level of participation of the people you run over. Like any deadly force incident it will depend on the facts of that particular incident.

    If I was a juror in addition to it meeting all the elements for the use of deadly force, I would want to know why you were in the middle of a riot.

    I’m not saying you can’t kill people posing a real threat to your life; have at it. But if you are trying to justify killing innocent people because others were threatening your life; you can’t. But a DA or a jury might.

    Would I allow myself to be pulled from a car by an angry mob? No.

  13. 12 minutes ago, Raoul said:

    This thing has certainly wandered off the reservation

    Well it had to. It started off with an old guy being pizzed off, a bunch of old retired happy guys jumped in, and some youngsters are mad that they can’t retire and afraid we are going to spend all their money. So it really had no reservation to wander off of. 😎

    • Like 1
    • Haha 3

  14. 1 hour ago, TomInMN said:

    So, breaching the passenger compartment constitutes carjacking. (I don't know if that's the case, but it seems plausible.) How does joint venture come into play here? If two or three people are breaking windows and standing on the side of the car, are you considered justified in running over a half dozen people in your (and your vehicle's) path as you escape?

    No. It just means you will do less prison time when you are convicted of running over others if they are innocent bystanders. Yes, Tennessee expanded the Castle Doctrine to your car. But that only means you have a presumption of innocence against the bad actors. It is a legal presumption and a DA can challenge it. It doesn’t create a free fire zone.

  15. 4 hours ago, FUJIMO said:

    I'm not speaking for Erik but this snow ball of schitt was building long before his generation came along. Playing the system has become a career for many and has since before my generation. Politicians continuing to pass laws and present bills that give handouts to those that don't ( not can't) put into system, healthcare, welfare, etc, eventually breaks the system. This is the result of decades of that. I can give you a half dozen examples of people right now that DRAW from the dole more than a lot of people make in a year.

    Oh I agree. Should people that are overweight because of their lifestyle draw disability. No, they should have to go to rehab. But I guess in this time of equality; that won’t happen. But it won’t matter if the wrong people (Biden, Harris, Pelosi, Schumer, AOC, the crew, and the likes) get to call the shots. AOC and her crew thinks everyone should get paid whether they work or not. And if you do work, they want to slap your employer with 12 weeks a year paid vacation. They have no idea how things (money) work.

    Biden says anyone that can mine coal can program. So why not put some of these people drawing disability in a soft chair and let them program. I’m joking of course; he’s an idiot.🙂

  16. 52 minutes ago, Erik88 said:

    Hearings stories from people who worked, paid taxes, and did everything society asks of them, only to have their savings wiped out because of medical bills, really bothers me. It's not right and it's not sustainable. 


    It’s not right Erik. When I was your age it was a non-issue. Most Companies had paid insurance. Industry was paying the bills. But as “A Global Economy” became the buzz word of the times, and our jobs were shipped overseas, American manufacturers had to cut costs; that was an area where they did it.

    Then Obama came along with his plan and assured everyone they would be able to keep their own plans; they would be unaffected. We all knew he was lying when he said it. It drove private employers costs through the roof; many working people lost their plans.

    Everyone is looking at a way to have affordable health care. With tax cuts for business and jobs coming back that could possibly happen. Biden has said he will renew the taxes that Trump cut for business. That means less jobs and lower wages to pay the health care bill.

    Working stiffs like you can afford health care insurance. You just don’t want to pay the exorbitant rates, because the impact would be so great it would mean less of a house, lower priced vehicles, and fewer vacations. But you will pay it because you know the consequences if you don’t. Poor people who can’t pay it won’t pay it, and they won’t lose everything they have because they don’t have anything. Illegals won’t pay their medical bills either; most can’t. So they are going to need you to pay for them as well as yourself. That’s fair isn’t it? Well I guess that depends on whether you believe in a hand up or a handout.

    Now….I know you won’t agree with any of this. Or agree that your generation got you in the jamb you find yourself it. But history will judge you harshly on what you have done. I don’t have to worry about one of my Grandkids asking “Grandpa, how could you have done this to us?” Can you say the same? (That’s rhetorical 🙃)

  17. 17 minutes ago, Ronald_55 said:

    I am confused... Are the guys in that video pulling them from the car not wearing Police labeled gear? I know this is just an example, but is it not the reverse of the situation? Though some context as to why this particular car was swarmed, windows smashed, and tires slashed would need to be in place to know what went on. 

    Yes, they are Police Officers. Two were fired immediately and three are on desk duty pending investigation. Apparently, an Officer yelled “He’s got a gun!” There was no gun.

    The Officers engaged with the occupants acted recklessly. With someone yelling gun, these people are lucky to be alive.


  18. 19 minutes ago, Ronald_55 said:

    No one protesting that got a video that justifies his actions is going to come forward. If he is lucky a concerned citizen bystander might have got something on film. Otherwise this WILL be a VERY uphill battle for him. In addition to his employer dropping him, I foresee his car insurance doing it also. Every business he works with is going to make him a pariah. On the other side, when civil cases come forth, I am betting a well versed big time lawyer is supplied to the protester by unknown sources. 

    In addition, we can look for much larger protests in this area to show opposition to him. Plus with the last few years, most police officers will be shy to stop the protesters for fear of being dismissed and seeing lawsuits themselves. They need a paycheck for their families too. 

    I would guess if there is video; it will come out. If I was investigating that incident, I would have the phone of the guy that was hit. And I would ask any witnesses to voluntarily give me their phones for inspection. If they refused I would hold them and try to get a warrant. However, I would be trying to find out what really happened. We can only hope the Police and DA are doing that.

    As far as his job goes…he is a realtor. If he tried to stay with that he would be a pretty easy target. If he was legally justified in what he did; he still will have a tough way to go.

    This incident is a good example of what we can expect in these times.

    I’m not saying he was justified, I have no idea, and the only video I’ve seen doesn’t change that.

    • Like 1

  19. 8 minutes ago, chances R said:

    There needs to be a law that makes for penalties to impede traffic with protests. 

    There already is. They aren't being enforced. 


    39-17-307. Obstructing highway or other passageway.
    (a) A person commits an offense who, without legal privilege, intentionally, knowingly or recklessly:
    (1) Obstructs a highway, street, sidewalk, railway, waterway, elevator, aisle, or hallway to which the public, or a substantial portion of the public, has access; or any other place used for the passage of persons, vehicles or conveyances, whether the obstruction arises from the person's acts alone or from the person's acts and the acts of others; or
    (2) Disobeys a reasonable request or order to move issued by a person known to be a law enforcement officer, a firefighter, or a person with authority to control the use of the premises to:
    (A) Prevent obstruction of a highway or passageway; or
    (B) Maintain public safety by dispersing those gathered in dangerous proximity to a fire, riot or other hazard.
    (b) For purposes of this section, “obstruct” means to render impassable or to render passage unreasonably inconvenient or potentially injurious to persons or property.
    (1) An offense under this section is a Class C misdemeanor.
    (2) Notwithstanding subdivision (c)(1), an offense under subdivision (a)(1) is a Class B misdemeanor and shall be punished by a fine of two hundred dollars ($200) if, at the time of the violation, the person obstructs an emergency vehicle from accessing the highway or street, or highway's or street's right-of-way. As used in this subdivision (c)(2), “emergency vehicle” means any vehicle of a governmental department or public service corporation when responding to an emergency, any vehicle of a police or fire department, and any ambulance.
    (1) It is an affirmative defense to prosecution under this section, which must be proven by a preponderance of the evidence, that:
    (A) Solicitation and collection of charitable donations at a highway or street intersection were undertaken by members of an organization that has received a determination of exemption from the internal revenue service under 26 U.S.C. § 501(c)(3) or (4);
    (B) The members of the organization undertook reasonable and prudent precautions to prevent both disruption of traffic flow and injury to person or property; and
    (C) The solicitation and collection at the specific time and place and the specific precautions were proposed in advance to, and received the prior written approval of, the administrative head of the local law enforcement agency in whose jurisdiction the intersection is located.
    (2) No liability for any accident or other occurrence that arises from solicitations shall attach to the sheriff or government involved in issuing the permit, but shall be borne solely by the organization obtaining the permit.
    (3) This subsection (d) shall not be construed to supersede or affect any ordinance relative to collecting donations at public intersections in effect on July 1, 1993.
    (4) Any municipality by ordinance may prohibit roadblocks within its corporate limits notwithstanding this subsection (d).


    • Like 2

  20. 12 minutes ago, FUJIMO said:

    Thats the one I just mentioned 😁. Thanks Dave !

    That’s why I posted it, thanks for the info. As I suspected in the prior post, there is good video of him plowing over people, one story even said the dog managed to escape injury, along with claiming the person hit was a “photographer” instead of a protestor. But so far, none of what took place, or what the protestors were doing on his side of the vehicle. I have no idea if he was justified or not, but he’s arrested, charged, and his employer has cut ties. Luckily they allowed him to bond out quickly, that may have not happened somewhere else. Him and his family are in for a world of grief.

    • Like 1

  21. This question has come up before. Often the answer is often “drive away”. Well, that’s common sense, so I assume people are asking about when you can’t drive away, without running over people. 

    Every situation will be different. The bottom line is, would a reasonable person believe you were in immediate danger of death or great bodily harm. Surrounding your car and yelling at you, would not meet that criteria. Someone approaching your car with a gun in their hand, someone threatening you while carrying a rifle or someone breaching your vehicle and trying to grab you, would.

    However keep in mind that in these situation, even if you are obviously justified, if you happen to get one of these liberal far left DA’s on the case, the chances are very good you are going to trial. There will probably be very little, if any, video of what happened prior, but there will be plenty of video of you running over people.

    We are now living in a time where in some areas of the country, to some politicians, protecting violent criminal thugs is more important than protecting innocent citizens.

    I would think that one of the biggest factors to a jury in a questionable case would be “why were you there?” Sure, there could be a situation where you would have to drive through a riot. That shouldn’t be a factor in applying the deadly force laws; but I suspect it would be.

    Getting a conviction would be hard for a DA that has run amuck in a case like this. You only need one juror to believe you were justified. But that doesn’t mean that DA won’t use his office to financially destroy you.

    • Like 2

  22. 2 hours ago, Erik88 said:

    Us young people are essentially subsidizing the older crowd which I understand. 

    Well dang Erik…Thank You!

    Here I thought the 50 years I worked and paid in, and the American Manufacturing industry that I worked in was paying. But it makes me smile to know that I was wrong, and you are carrying me. 🤣

    BTW… I predict that the health care won’t be an issue by the time you retire. But you probably will have to sell your house because you won’t be able to pay the property taxes that are going to be going out of sight.

    • Like 4

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