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JayC

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Everything posted by JayC

  1. The federal law only covers interstate commerce. Transporting within the borders of TN is not covered. Unless the city/county/state has a law that he was violating.
  2. Guys, just an FYI to clear up a myth about the passed hb0962, if they serve liquor they are a restaurant not a bar. Under the passed language, any establishment that has a restaurant liquor license we can carry in once the law goes into effect if not posted. There are not "bar" liquor licenses in TN, and if the state of TN grants a restaurant liquor license, they have verified for you that you can carry in the establishment. (With one minor exception that the liquor license only requires them to serve meals 4 days a week, not 5, but I seriously doubt many places being effected by that). There are no "bars" in TN as far as the TN ABC is concerned. Places that only sell beer could still be an issue, depending on how the hotel is licensed, it could be an issue, other places the government owns, or 501c run community buildings could also be an issue. Everything else with a liquor license is safe to carry in, including places that we'd call "bars". Sorry to keep harping on this issue, but I just want to clear up any misconceptions people have about where we can or can't carry.
  3. Maybe... If they have a restaurant liquor license then yes (which most of the above should), if they only serve beer, then it's a maybe if they meet the requirements of hb0962 as passed. The bill is a huge step forward... Most businesses that serve will be covered, but there are still some "maybe" areas... but as a general rule, if it's a free standing building and they serve liquor (and aren't on the "other" list) then it should be safe to carry in them as long as they're not posted.
  4. Yeah, no grey area... I know the wording can be concerning, but I just happen to be involved in a family ran business (my wifes side) which includes a bar/pool hall... So I know all about the pesky "Serving of meals shall be the principal business conducted" requirement. The good news is virtually all free standing buildings serving liquor will be open to carry unless properly posted.
  5. They have been issued a TN state 'restaurant liquor license'... The state requirements for that license are: 1. A public place kept, used, maintained, advertised and held out to the public as a place where meals are served and where meals are actually and regularly served. 2. Without sleeping accommodations. 3. Supplied with adequate and sanitary kitchen and dining room equipment. 4. Seating capacity of at least seventy-five (75) at tables. 5. Employing a sufficient number and kind of employees to prepare, cook and serve suitable food. 6. Serve at least one (1) meal a day at least four (4) days a week. 7. Serving of meals shall be the principal business conducted Tennessee Alcoholic Beverage Commission The state has verified that all businesses which have a state restaurant liquor license meet those requirements as part of issuing the license, so therefore the state has themselves verified you can carry in them (with the 1 exception of 4 meals a week vs 5 meals a week but I doubt seriously many businesses will be impacted by that).
  6. The definition in the Senate amendment is from the restaurant liquor license definition. With exceptions of liquor licenses issued to hotels (and only to the hotels), and the other class (mostly government and non-profit owned location) Tennessee Alcoholic Beverage Commission all other businesses which sell liquor in the state of TN have a restaurant liquor license. As such they meet all the requirements of the HB0962 as passed with 1 minor exception (the restaurant liquor license only requires meals to be served 4 days a week, not 5) but I suspect the number of establishments impacted by this difference to be very small. In short, it's legal to carry in any location (once the bill becomes law) with a restaurant liquor license unless it's posted, and it should be safe because the state has verified they meet all the requirements under HB0962 as passed for you.
  7. It appears as if the vote is veto proof.
  8. I'm pretty sure the 24 hour period was only for the conference report going from the committee to the floor... Most likely they're waiting on the House to vote, so they can keep their options open. For example if the House defeats the conference report, the Senate would have time to vote on the House version so something gets passed.
  9. I've watched 2 or 3 of these sessions over the last month or so, it seems they normally do the message calendar last.
  10. I stand corrected, the current language of the House Adm #1 would block if they card 18+, not 21+. The language from the Senate version if re-introduced in conference would be 21+.
  11. I'd guess if they are using wristbands that means they're allowing 18-20 year olds into the building as well (Only time I've seen wrist bands used were to tell the difference between 21+ and others)... If that is the case it's not an age restricted venue under the law. They must card and only allow 21+ into the building.
  12. The restaurant is breaking the law, but currently the local health inspectors aren't enforcing this. It's not different than saying a sign with a handgun and a circle/line through it isn't a properly posted building and therefore you can still carry. Technically you're not breaking the law, but there is a slight risk you might have to get a lawyer to prove it. I suspect that we'll see some LEOs who don't fully understand the law at first and it will take some run-ins before things settle down. But, age restricted venue is clearing defined in the law as a place that requires everybody entering to show ID (and be restricted to 21+). If they don't do that, they're not an age restricted venue under the law.
  13. It's only age restricted if they card at the door, not if they post a sign.
  14. We'll be able to carry in pretty much establishment which has a 'restaurant liquor license' which is well over 90% of the places that serve liquor, hotels are a maybe, most of the 'other' licenses will be a no. Keep in mind this is assuming they don't card at the door (21+) or are properly posted.
  15. I wasn't sure whether to post that information about liquor licenses before the bill was passed, I don't want word getting out just how open the bill is for fear that some repcritters would change their votes. Best we all keep this little bit of good news under our belts until after it become law.
  16. Well, there are a couple of issues with your logic. First, in the state of TN there isn't a 'bar' liquor license. With the exception of special events, and 'other' (which are strictly limited to certain government owned/operated and non-profit organizations, large tourist resorts) there are no 'bars' in the state of TN. So, virtually all of those 'pure bars' and saloons have been issued 'restaurant liquor licenses' under state law, and as such meet all the requirements of this bill as verified by the state. See, TN law requires all 'restaurant' liquor licenses to serve food, and provide at least 75 seats for their customers to eat. And they verify this requirement as part of issuing the license. So under the current wording of this bill, with one small exception if they've been issued a restaurant liquor license they meet all the requirements (note, liquor license requires you to serve food 4 days a week not 5, so a very small number of businesses could have an issue if they're only open 4 days a week, or only server food 4 days a week but I suspect that is very rare). I don't think anybody here is suggesting you go out and get drunk while carrying... but I can think of some traditional 'bars' I might want to go into from time to time, and enjoy things other than drinking. Maybe, I want to play darts, or billiards with some buddies after work... there are lots of valid reasons to go to a 'bar' after work and not drink.
  17. True, but keep in mind, that the current definition for restaurant is very good for us, I spoke with one of the folks at the ABC board today and they told me well over 90% of liquor licenses are 'restaurant liquor licenses'... They didn't have an exact percentage but she said the number of hotel, other, and special event are very few. Still leaves some grey area on businesses that only serve beer, or wine... but the vast majority of the places most of us will go are safe to carry under this bill.
  18. IANAL, but here is what the bill says... So, lets go look at that section of the current TN code... ( Michie's Legal Resources ) So, as per my layman understanding of the way the bill is currently worded with the age-restriction language included, unless they card at the door, and verify your ID, and they only allow 21+ in, then it's not an age restricted venue. If they card and let 18 year olds in, not age restricted as per this bill.Basically, you're right if they just have a sign up, or it doesn't count under this bill. (Or any other bill/law using 39-17-1802 as it's definition.
  19. As the bill is currently written, unless they card at the door, it's not an age restricted restaurant under this bill.
  20. Your post was talking about % of sales... I was just pointing out that by the fact a restaurant has a liquor license, the state of TN has verified it meets virtually all of the requirements of this bill. Which is going t include places like bowling alley's, bars, and movie theaters. As for places that only sell beer, you're right those are only regulated by local beer boards... And those establishments in dry counties my well pose a problem under this bill, but the vast major of people going to restaurants in cities will be going to establishments with 'restaurant liquor licenses'. My point again is that the current wording in cases where the establishment serves liquor takes all the worry off of us as HCP holders, because the state has already verified all the conditions to carry. While I'm sure there will be some places here and there that don't serve liquor but do serve beer, the fact remains it's very hard making a living running a bar that can't serve liquor. A large chunk of those places in a dry county will meet the bills requirements as well. (Because like a pizza place that sells beer, the vast majority of the sales are going to be for pizza not beer).
  21. I have to disagree, the wording from the bill comes from the current legal definition of a restaurant liquor license. (With 1 minor exception that the liquor license only requires meals 4 days a week not 5) The good news is the way the law is worded the state has verified that every establishment with a 'restaurant liquor license' meets the requirement for carry under this bill. (With the exception for the 4 days vs 5 days a week, carding persons over 21, and legal posting) I wrote a fairly in dept post over at tfaonline that highlights the different types of liquor licenses, and how they impact this bill. Tennessee Firearms Assoc. Inc. • View topic - SB1127 (HB0962) Restaurant bill approved by Sen. Jud. The short answer is that virtually every free standing building which serves liquor has a "restaurant liquor license" and therefore unless they only serve meals 4 days a week, card at the door for persons 21+ years of age, or have a properly worded posting barring firearms, once this bill becomes law HCP holders will be able to carry in them. Most of the places you're talking about bowling alleys, "bars", movie theaters (some exception here for 501c3 community theaters), and just about all the common establishments all have 'restaurant liquor licenses' and therefore the state have verified all of the required conditions for you (again with the noted exceptions above).

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