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Everything posted by JayC

  1. As you requested... Nashville.gov - Metro Council Feedback Form Step 1 choose "Entire Metro Council" and fill out the rest... Not sure if they'll read the emails but it can't hurt. I'd also strongly suggest calling too...
  2. The only thing going for us is the fact that 39-17-1314 blocks any regulation relating to the possession of firearms after April 1st 1986... I'm not exactly sure how requiring businesses to ban is any different than banning out right from a legal stand point. Now getting 39-17-1314 enforced in short order is the hard part, best bet is to put pressure on the Metro Council to not pass this ordinance to being with.
  3. If this works for Nashville, nothing will stop the beer boards for surrounding counties and cities from doing the exact same thing. One of the few good things about our states firearm laws were that they are the same all over the state. If we let these types of games be played by local county and city governments, we'll all have to carry around a chart to show where we can or can't carry.
  4. Under the law it does... possession is the act of carrying a firearm under TN law currently. The real question for the courts will be whether the beer board is 1. part of a government covered by 39-17-1314, and 2. that them not granting beer permits based on requiring businesses to post is "any part of the field of regulation of the" possession. The truth is they can pass it, get Beer Board to enforce it, and we get to spend the next X number of years fighting it in court via the NRA or some other gun group. Or get the legislature to pass a law that closes the "supposed" loop hole. Another course would be to try and get a opinion letter from the AG stating that this would be a violation of 39-17-1314, but how likely that is who knows. I have a meeting with my State Senator on Monday, I'm going to press him to introduce legislation to close this "supposed" loop hole. But it's likely that would take the better part of a year to work it's way through the legislature.
  5. Guys, I spoke with Charlie Tygard this afternoon, they are serious about this ordinance, and are trying to force business to post in order to have a beer permit... Best not to wait until after they have proposed the ordinance but to go ahead and get in touch with the Metro Council now not later... FYI, here is the link to the list of Nashville Council Members, included are phone numbers and email addresses. If you live inside Davidson County you should at least email and/or call all the at large members and any members who cover areas where you live, work, and dine out. Although comments to all wouldn't hurt either. Nashville.gov - Metro Council - Council Roster
  6. FYI, here is the link to the list of Nashville Council Members, included are phone numbers and email addresses. If you live inside Davidson County you should at least email and/or call all the at large members and any members who cover areas where you live, work, and dine out. Although comments to all wouldn't hurt either. http://www.nashville.gov/council/council_roster.htm
  7. Just a heads up, got off the phone with Bo Mitchell 35th District Councilmember (Bellevue area)... He's not only for this beer permit ordiance, he's also said while I was on the phone that only police officers should be allowed to carry handguns that would solve a lot of issues. Even though he claims to be "pro 2A". Nashville.gov - Metro Council - District 35 Councilmember Bo Mitchell
  8. Yes very much so... everybody should be sending them emails and phone calls. Also, having people show up for the council meets to speak out against this ordinance would be a huge help as well.
  9. Well Charlie indicated that some restaurant owners are concerned they'll loose business if they choose to post, so basically they want to force a level playing field. Most of these restaurant owners don't even live in Davidson County.
  10. That is the game plan to require you to post to have a beer permit.
  11. If you live in Davidson County, please give Charlie a call or send him an email I just got off the phone with him and he's only heard for half a dozen people before me on this matter and all (except for me) were in favor of an ordinance. A very vocal minority of restaurant owners don't want to loose business by having to post, and therefore are trying to force all restaurants with a beer permit to not allow HCP holders.
  12. I seriously don't see that going anywhere... Nashville Metro knows they can't pass anti-firearms laws under current state law... Any attempt would be over turned by the courts.
  13. I don't know if I agree completely... as much as we like to mock the left, their tactics for forcing change seem to work pretty well... I remember the gay pride floats in big cities being a huge deal as a kid, small riots breaking out because of it... Last year I saw one in a small town here in Middle TN's parade and nobody said a word about it. I'm not saying we should go around wearing ass-less chaps... but being vocal and pushing the public at large and legislators to give us our rights back doesn't seem like such a bad idea. My argument is unless the group are horrible customers, very few restaurant owners are going to kick them out or post over it. It's hard to turn away 20-30 customers in this economy for any reason, let alone for carrying a gun legally.
  14. Yes, because that has been the outcome at all the other places people have open carried at for meetings right? I don't want to start the OC/CC debate again... but there just isn't a lot of facts to support this argument... People have gun club meets in restaurants today, many times people at those meetings are open carrying, yet not only does Shoney's (insert other names here) not post, they invite the group back month after month. I've chosen to open carry into restaurants on a fairly regular basis (my business attire I wear day to day doesn't allow me to conceal carry) rather than go unarmed, never had a problem with a business owner/manager asking me to leave. You're right if a bunch of people come into a restaurant and act like complete retards and are bad customers then sure that business may very well post, and while we do have some people like that who have HCP's in TN the vast vast majority are responsible citizens who won't cause a business to post. Just for the record and in hopes of not starting the OC/CC debate... I think CC is always the best choice when you can, but OC is better than not carrying at all. Most important of all it's a personal choice that should be left up to each person as what works best for them.
  15. While we and the media refer to it as HB0962 keep in mind the exact same bill is also tracked as SB1127... Again I'm not positive of the process inside the House/Senate only that the TN Constitution allows either the House or Senate to take it up first then pass the results to the Senate. Since it does appear to have to start in one or the other, then move to the other they may have chosen to start in the House.
  16. I thought the House adapted the Senate version of the bill? Because the House version had both the 11pm curfew as well as age-restriction... where as the Senate version did not? Maybe a conference report is handled differently. I do know the TN Constitution allows either 'House' of the Legislature to take up a veto override... Now there maybe some legislature rules that dictate something else. Or the conference report may play some role in this again since conference reports are largely a legislature rule, and I haven't read all of those rules
  17. I could be mistaken, but I'm pretty sure they both have to sign it again... And back before it went to the Governor, the bill sat on the Speaker of the House desk for a day or two waiting on his signature. If I get a few minutes today I'll do the research on TN veto overrides, but I'm pretty sure they must sign some official paper work before this bill becomes law. Also, keep in mind that while this was passed first in the House it didn't need to, it could in theory have been brought up in the Senate first.... So the Senate taking this up today is not technically because they were waiting on the House.
  18. The Governor is out of the loop if this bill is approved by the Senate, but we do have to wait until both Speakers of the House and Senate have signed the bill to become law. It may take a couple of days.
  19. The entire reason to have business insurance is to defend your business from different types of civil lawsuits. Anything from slip and falls, to wrongful death. And you're correct your rates do go up for a short period of time whenever you have a claim on your policy (my experience 3-4 years)... But largely you have no control over who files a lawsuit against you... Trust me if you run a business that is open to the public (like say a restaurant) then you're going to have a claim on your insurance before too long. People will file suit over the dumbest things (for example being so drunk they slip out of a chair and hit the ground, even though you refused them service - not a single drink - because they were too drunk - yes that happened and the insurance company paid out on it). From my experience customers largely don't notice gun issues, they don't pick a place to eat based off of whether they allow HCP or not, they're just oblivious to it (much like how they don't notice you carrying a gun 95% of the time)... I'm not going to end up on a list for not posting, my business name isn't going to be in the paper, nor posted all over internet sites for allowing people to carry. A few very liberal people might notice, and might even say something... but I'm not going to loose much business over not posting. On the other hand, if I post, I'm going to have a TFA/TGO forum post listing my business and asking people not to do business with me... I might get in a list from the NRA/GOA/etc emailed out to all their members asking them to not come to my restaurant... And some % of HCP holders are going to skip my restaurant because the one down the street allows carry and I don't. (Trust me, we've seen this from smoking...) I for sure can't afford a 1%-4% drop in sales in this economy.... Or worse pass up an increase of 1%-4% in sales from HCP holders who will now consider my restaurant... I know from experience that insurance rates aren't significantly different between states which allow carry in restaurants vs states like TN (currently) which do not. If there was a real cost increase to the insurance company they would pass it along... We may see a rash of incidents, and insurance rates may go up, but I seriously doubt it... Here is the general rule of thumb... If it reduced costs more than the negative issues with allowing it, do you think McD's, Burger King, Shoney's, Sears, Walmart and other such business would be posted? While you have a point, a HCP shoots somebody in your business somebody is going to file a lawsuit... but if you post, and a HCP who would otherwise have been able to carry gets hurt/killed, which lawsuit do you think is going to hurt more? The lawsuit arguement can cut both ways... Posting seems to carry a lot of negatives, and very few positives... Now, for the record, both my family, and my wife's family are involved in the restaurant business in Middle TN for many decades each. I'm technically a manager grade employee in one of the businesses (which has given me the added bonus of being able to legally carry in those restaurants)... Because the news media and bloggers check these forums on a regular basis I'm not disclosing which restaurants just because I don't want my comments showing up in the paper, and also for the record, these comments are my personal feelings on the subject not official policy of either business. On another note, I can tell you that for years I've just not eaten in other restaurants because I wasn't able to legally carry... I'd drive out of my way or select restaurants for business meetings based on whether I could carry or not... I'm looking forward to going out to a non-family owned place this weekend and getting a meal (more importantly my wife is really looking forward to it). While I maybe the exception to the rule here, my guess is I'm not alone. I also honestly think most restaurants will not post, because there is very little or no upside to posting. <input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden"><input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden">
  20. Restaurants which are "age restricted" are not smoke free in TN. But, that part of the bill was removed from the passed bill (soon to be law).


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