Cruel Hand Luke

That is pretty much it. He'll also want a pen and note pad for the lecture portion. My advice also (having taken it in August myself) is to hydrate well BEFORE you go to the class and drink lots of water and gator aid each day. It can be VERY hot and humid there in August. He definitely will have enough to worry with knocking down targets without having to fight dehydration too. Hmmmmm next week eh? He'll be there for the eclipse....that's pretty cool an eclipse at Rogers. That will make for an interesting time.

I have been. Here is the review I posted here after I got back...... I spent last week in the mountains of Ellijay Georgia at the Rogers Shooting School (http://www.rogersshootingschool.com/). For those not familiar with the school it is owned and run by Bill Rogers, former FBI agent, inventor ( Safariland duty holster ALS and SLS and GLS locks, Wilson/Rogers 1911 mags, Rogers Super Stock, etc) and world class shooter who won a metric ton of matches in the 80s and 90s and beyond. In fact I was recently flipping through an old issue of Soldier of Fortune from 1986 looking at an article about the SOF 3 Gun Match and lo and behold but who was 2nd over all? Bill Rogers....yep...that Bill Rogers. The class normally runs a week starting on Sunday evening and finishing up on Friday afternoon. The class normally runs $1200 for the week and 2500 rounds of ammo. This is quite an investment in time , money , and ammo for most people. But the deal of the century might be the way I did it . I took it as the 3 day Rogers Reactive Steel Course offered through my friend Ronnie Dodd's company Dodd and Associates (http://www.doddtraining.com/). This class runs Wednesday night through Saturday afternoon . Ronnie is also the chief instructor at Rogers and that is how he is able to offer the 3 day class using the Rogers facilities and the Rogers assistant instructors. During the class I stayed in the Rogers Lodge ( $75 for the class) and Bill Rogers himself made an appearance at the class so it was pretty much as close to the 5 day class experience as the 3 day class could be. Of course there is no free lunch, (well....actually lunch is included in the class) and you cannot fit 5 days into 3 so you will get 4 runs on the test instead of the normal 6 and you will only shoot 1500 rounds for the class instead of the normal 2500 and no Thursday night low light shoot like in the 5 day class. At Rogers they teach what they call Reactive Shooting. That is shooting within human reaction time. It takes someone .25 of a second to observe and a .25 to respond if there is no other decision making involved. So a simple "see it , point the gun at it and shoot it" would be a half second. The target system used at the school consists of 8" plates that appear and disappear in very short time increments. They range in distance from 7 yards to 9 yards to 10 yards to 15 to 19 yards. One of the first drills we shoot is a shot in one half second at a 7 yard target. We then shoot 2 targets in 1 second, and then 3 targets in 1.5 seconds. The drills don't get any easier either. The practice is all geared toward the test which you shoot each day to determine your score and class ranking. Each person shoots about 500 rounds per day. This can seem daunting to some , especially guys shooting heavier caliber guns. Guys who show up with .45s often switch to 9mm in short order. One gentleman in our class shot his 1911 .45 on day one and promptly switched to his 9mm 1911 for the rest of the class. Of course some Mil and LE units that come to class with bigger caliber duty weapons (think SEALs, Delta, Marine Recon and FBI HRT, etc). You see Rogers is not the typical "Firearm safety class" it is a doctorate level test of marksmanship. You either sink or swim . You either acclimate to the speed of the targets and force yourself to see the sights and make the hits or you miss a lot and watch plates disappear. The targets do not care that you are shooting with 2 hands or with one or with your strong or your weak hand. The time frames are all the same. After all, the bad guys won't take it easy on you if you are injured and having to shoot with one hand...... There is not much downtime in the class. You are either loading magazines, shooting drills, hydrating, watching the instructors demonstrate drills, or eating lunch. Even during lunch the target system runs so that if you choose to you can hurry up and eat lunch and then get some dry practice in. And every little bit helps while preparing for the test. The instructors are there always offering constructive suggestions, and offering encouragement. And as opposed to some other schools, all the instructors can shoot at a high level. They have to in order to demonstrate the drills. At the end of each day you shoot the test. It is an 9 stage 125 round course of fire. The first stage is 3 rounds on 3 different targets from the extended low ready position in 1.5 seconds. The 2nd is from the ready engaging 4 plates in near to far order in 2 seconds. And it just gets more difficult from there. Number 8 can cause nightmares as it is 23 plates in 3 waves all shot weak handed with 2 weak hand only reloads thrown in....all in 23 seconds. Not exactly for the faint of heart. There is a reason that not many people clean the test. In fact only 4 people have ever shot the test with a perfect 125. Bill Rogers, Rob Leatham, Manny Bragg and Gabe White have shot a perfect 125. As mentioned earlier your scores count toward what certificate you graduate with. Score less than 70 on the test and you do not pass. Pass the test with 70 points and you get a Basic Certificate. Pass with a 90 and you get an Intermediate certificate. Pass with 110 or more and you graduate Advanced. They say less than 5% pass at the Advanced level and only those 4 guys have ever cleaned it. Some of my peers in the shooting and training industry who have already been had been waiting for a long time for me to finally make the pilgrimage to Rogers. Unfortunately classes at Rogers usually fill up and they are not always offered when I am free. I stay busy between my day job, teaching and match shooting. So when the opportunity hit to do the the 3 day class in between teaching my own classes and shooting matches I was glad to finally get to attend this class. As to my performance? Well I didn't do as well as I would have liked, but then again, only 4 guys ever have. I ended up graduating Advanced with a 115 score and the coveted red pin for the Top Shooter in the class. If you get the chance to go to the full 5 day class that would be great, but if time, and money are an issue then take a serious look at the three day class run through Dodd and Associates. You'll be glad you did.

This one is coming up in just about a month....

ONE WEEK TO GO!!!!!!!!

A quick bump for folks who have not seen this .....

Fortunately I have never met all those cops that use the "low pay" as you put it, as an excuse to terrorize citizens...maybe I just live in a different area. The GOOD cops don't get paid any better than the bad. Yet they are often expected to make perfect decisions in a split second , risk life and limb to protect people they don't know and who frankly often have a low opinion of them, doing it with training geared toward limiting liability for the department more than actually increasing officer survival and they are supposed to do it all with a smile while not making much more than $25000 a year starting out. The question becomes why would someone WANT to do it? Fortunately for society there are people that do sign on to do it. Some people are just drawn to the "protector" role. Are they all good? No but there are more good than bad and frankly we can probably attribute more to ignorance than to malice when something like this happens.

And we can make the argument that "more than fairly compensated" does not really apply when it is taking 60 (or more) hours a week to get that compensation....not counting the damage it often does to relationships and to sleep cycles which leads to bad decision making on the job. Force Science News has done tons of research on bad police decision making and attributes a lot of it to officers not sleeping enough or sleeping a regular sleep schedule... The guys I know all work extra jobs and a lot of OT out of necessity not just because they'd rather work than be at home with the wife and kids.

That is what every single officer who has ever asked if I was armed said when they ran my DL (and saw that I had a permit).

MAYBE with A LOT of overtime and working extra jobs. I don't know any street officers making 6 figures....most street cops barely make mid 5 figures. In fact the median Police Patrol Officer salary in Chattanooga is $47,693.

I mean concealed as in out of sight.... not "hiding in plain sight". If her shirt had covered it there might not have been an incident to begin with. Again what they did is NOT her fault....but if they don't see it...it probably doesn't happen the same way. Not to derail this thread but this falls in the category of people being amazed that others pick up on them "being armed" by spotting the pocket clipped knife in their pocket, or someone seeing the bottom half of their OWB holster that just happens to be sticking out from under their skin tight T shirt, and dudes at the airport dressed like they are going directly to baghdad shocked at getting their "tactical pens" confiscated in the TSA line.

"I'm from the government...I'm here to help...." While the overwhelming majority of police officers are conscientious and do a good job for little pay and less appreciation you also see instances where things like this happen. This woman was treated like a criminal , her liberty taken away and booked into jail because of a mistake. It is not like a normal business where a mistake would be she asked for coke and got diet coke instead. She was booked into jail. She should at the very minimum get any attorneys fees, lost wages and some sort of reasonable settlement for emotional damages. On the other hand....if the gun had been concealed none of this would have likely happened because they would not have seen the gun in the first place. Some of you don't like hearing that, but truth is truth. It may be your right to open carry but it also creates situations that would not be created if a gun were not visible.

TWO WEEKS TO GO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

ALERT-BREAKING NEWS!!!!OK so it is looking like we are doing BBQ sandwiches, chips and baked beans delivered to the range as the dinner plan. We will have sweet Tea and Water and Coke too. If you want anything else feel free to bring it. I'm covering the cost of dinner and having it delivered so we can all just kick back and eat and relax and socialize while we wait for the sun to get lower. Also, bring some extra duty/carry ammo to see how much flash it has in low and no light. If you want to bring a rifle or shotgun to test the flash of that ammo you are also welcome to do so . If you are planning to attend and have not yet said you are in (Rjcakrueger, 05fltri, and Ghost Dog have already posted) then please post here you are coming so I can make sure we are good on ordering enough food. Lookin' forward to it!

Just a little over two weeks to go on this rarely offered class!

I'm posting this for a friend . I have taken this class and HIGHLY recommend it to others. It is not EASY but it is worth it. I have taken classes at and instructed at this range and I can tell you the the guys from Condition One Firearms Academy (the hosts) run a solid operation and did a great job when they have hosted classes in the past. You won't regret it....get signed up! PLEASE SEE THIS LINK TO REGISTER: HTTPS://WWW.EVENTBRITE.COM/E/FIREARMS-INSTRUCTOR-DEVELOPMENT-COURSE-FRANKLIN-TN-TICKETS-29341179257 Rangemaster Three-Day Firearms Instructor Development & Certification Course Friday through Sunday, 9am-6pm each day Franklin, Tennessee on a private outdoor range September 29 through October 1, 2017 This is an intensive full three day (24 hours total) course that teaches candidates: modern adult learning theory; preparation, delivery, and documentation of training; development of training aids, including power points and others; coaching methodologies, diagnosing and correcting shooters’ errors; modern, effective gunhandling techniques, designed to work under stress; proper handling/operation of a variety of handgun types; and effective, efficient combat marksmanship techniques. The course time is divided about equally between classroom sessions and range firing, and each student will fire approximately 1,000 rounds of ammunition. Students will act as coaches for other students, and each will be coached extensively in turn. Students also receive a 200+ page training manual, which is a valuable information and reference resource. To graduate from this course, students must pass a shooting qualification and pass a written examination. This course satisfies the training requirements for the Oklahoma CLEET requirements to become an OK SDA Instructor, for a state firearms instructor license in South Carolina by SLED, for 24 hours of continuing education credit in South Carolina by SCCJA, and for 24 hours training credit by Georgia POST. For this course, students will need: A serviceable sidearm, revolver or semiauto, of at least .38 Special or 9X19mm caliber ( .38 Special, 9mm, .357 SIG, .40 S&W, .45 Auto); A serviceable uniform duty or concealed carry holster, worn on the belt, of leather or kydex construction, with a covered trigger guard; At least three magazines or speedloaders (more is better); 1,000 rounds of ammunition for the sidearm For further information or answers to questions, please contact Tom Givens, rangemaster.tom@gmail.com .

CRG-1: PISTOL GUNFIGHTING SEPTEMBER 16-17, 2017 Price: $350 CHATTANOOGA, TENNESSEE INSTRUCTOR: RANDY HARRIS Instructor Bio All training must begin with fundamentals. This comprehensive fundamentals class is designed to prep you for the more advanced courses such as Close Range Gunfighting. Through a carefully designed and detailed curriculum we are able to bring you up to a level of skill in a short two day class that previously would take over 4 or 5 days to achieve at other schools. You will learn a complete presentation of the modern combative technique of the pistol which will put you in good standing for any defensive situations you may encounter in the real world. We will also be incorporating fundamental Point Shooting techniques which will prep you for more advanced courses. You will learn the components of various point shooting methods and integrate them into your existing skill sets. This knowledge will put you in good standing for any defensive situations you may encounter in the real world. No experience or prior training is needed to attend this class and it is specially suitable for beginners, or as a tune-up for accomplished shooters. CLASS AND RANGE DETAILS DURATION: 2 days TIME: 9:00AM to 5:00PM Range is on Central Time AMMUNITION: Approximately 300 rounds (Minimum) RANGE & GEAR REQUIREMENTS: Modern defensive pistol and a holster specifically made for that pistol and designed to be worn on the belt. Three (3) magazines and magazine pouch, a belt of the same width as the belt loops for the holster and magazine pouches, and range safety gear (eye protection, and ear protection). Also Helpful Bring spare clothing appropriate for the weather, including a hat, sunscreen, and bug repellent. Plan to bring lunch, snacks, and water (min 1 gallon per person) for the entire day unless driving to lunch is a viable option from the range location. Bring allergy medication (if needed), a chair (if you prefer), note taking supplies, and a boo boo kit (band aids, gauze pads, antiseptic wipes, antibiotic ointment and tape). You may wish to bring pads such as knee pads, elbow pads, and gloves if the class lends itself to that. For more info and to register.....https://suarezinternational.com/crg-1-pistol-gunfighting-september-16-17-2017-chattanooga-tn/

Hey Aqil, check your private messages.

No, I'm sure we'll probably offer another in the fall.....let me look at my schedule and see what we can do. It would be good to see you again !

Only TWO weeks to go!

Just about 5 weeks to go on this one!

Getting in here way late, but I do have more than just a tiny bit of experience with Red Dot pistols.... There is a learning curve to it. It is not magic. You can't just buy one and it make you an awesome shooter. In fact if you are a GOOD shooter it might in fact make you a worse shooter for a while as you acclimate to the RDS. The first weekend after I got mine I shot a GSSF match and did better (demonstrably better) with my iron sighted gun than I did with my red dot gun. But that was comparing a gun I had less than 3 days with to a type of gun I'd been shooting for 20 years. Not a fair comparison at all. Part of that learning curve is finding the dot on the draw. If your draw is a random harem scarem "grip it, rip it and thrust it at the target and then try to find the sights" then you will be much slower finding the dot inside the little window. On the other hand if you smoothly draw the gun up into your eye line as you extend it while looking for the iron sights the dot will be there. This sounds simple (and is simple) but some people have a hard time with it until they actually PRACTICE doing it. The dot is not going to do anything for you at 3 to 5 yards that your irons will not do . The dot simply adds (and multiplies) your ability at distance. In fact once you cross the 15 yard line the dot is like cheating due to the much smaller aiming point . BUT....it takes some getting used to. One other added benefit to the red dot is it is an on board dry fire tool. You can use it for dry fire practice to see via the dot's movement just how much trigger finger finesse you have. If the dot pretty well stays on the front sight as you press the trigger then your trigger manipulation is solid. If it jumps all over the place as you press the trigger then you need to work a bit more to smooth out your trigger control. Here's one of mine......

On the evening of Saturday July 29 we will be offering a LOW LIGHT Training Day. Come out and work those pistol and flashlight skills you learned in CRG 2 or in the Low Light class or Low Light FOF classes. We will do a little refresher dry work and then spend the majority of the time working on live fire drills in diminishing and low light. This is the perfect opportunity to get some reps of live fire both with and without your flashlight in diminishing and low light. If you've never shot in the dark then you have a serious hole in your skill set. The first time you shoot in low light should not be in a real confrontation. Come out and work these skills and have some fun!SUAREZ INTERNATIONAL TN / GA / AL Training Group When: SATURDAY July 29 Instructor: Tier 1 Suarez Int Staff Instructor Randy HarrisLocation: The usual place- Phillips/Edwards Farm 763 County Rd 332 Pisgah AL 35765 Time: 5PM CENTRAL time - 11PM CENTRAL timePrice: $100 - pay at class cash or check. Notice the price is a little higher than usual because the material is a bit more advanced due to the low light environment. What you need to bring: Pistol, pistol magazines, FLASHLIGHT and at least 200 rounds of ammo. Revolvers are welcome if you want to party like it is 1899. WEAPON MOUNTED LIGHTS ARE FINE BUT MAKE SURE YOU BRING A HANDHELD LIGHT ALSO. Also if you want to bring a rifle or shotgun or pistol caliber carbine or your Stakeout to see how the muzzle flash really is in low light then bring them. We can shoot some drills with weapons other than pistols too. I'd like to get a head count on this for who is planning to attend so please either respond in this thread or PM me if you plan to attend. Instead of breaking for dinner we might just cook out at the range but I will need a solid count on how many we have coming to make that happen. Hope to see you (or not see you ) there.

Two weeks to go on this one and we still have spots available. Hope to see you there!

When making decisions about safety and "threat vs non threat " we need to look at the whole picture in making decisions... not just clothes or skin color or tattoos....The overwhelming majority of people are good people. And no race has the monopoly on kindness... or cruelty for that matter. A black guy in a suit on the streets of Chattanooga at lunchtime is going to appear as far less of a threat than a black guy dressed in "urban street attire" in Alton Park at 11PM. And there are plenty of candy ass white kids who like to dress like gangbangers...... and not every black guy with a red shirt on is a "Blood".....But to dismiss the combination of tattoos (especially gang affiliation tats ) , race and clothing is just naive. The pasty white dude with the "88" tattoo on his shoulder and "spider web" tat on his elbow is advertising to you what his background is if you know how to read the signs. Add to that a pair of black BDU pants and combat boots and a shaved head and you have someone I will consider a threat until proven otherwise....even though I am a white guy too and have a good friend who is a pasty white guy with a shaved head....But the guy with the tattoos and the "uniform" is a potential threat simply due to how he is advertising himself. Just like I'd see the totality of circumstances and big picture with a black guy with pants hanging down , tattoos of a 6 pointed star and a pitchfork (Crip Gang symbols) and a North Carolina "NC" hat (Northside Crips) turned to one side. Or a brown guy with tattoos of the Virgin Mary and " MS13" tattoo....they all are telling a story if you just read the page.... And looking at the whole picture is how we make better decisions on whether something is dangerous or not. It is not just race...or just clothing ...or just tattoos....or just body language... it is the totality of circumstances. And if that makes you feel bad then I suggest you spend less time watching Oprah and listening to NPR.

SPECIAL 3 DAY EVENT WITH MORE MATERIAL INCLUDING TREATING TRAUMATIC INJURIES !!! More material, more reps, more force on force, and a block of instruction on treating traumatic injuries! SUAREZ INTERNATIONAL HRO-5: TERRORIST / ACTIVE SHOOTER INTERDICTION AUGUST 11-13, 2017 Price: $500 DAYTON, TENNESSEE INSTRUCTOR: RANDY HARRISINSTRUCTOR BIOEXTRA THIRD DAY!This special 3 Day version of this class also includes blocks of instruction on trauma care in the field. Trey Hudson will be guest lecturer on topics of history of terrorism, personal security measures and counter terrorism! Trey currently works as a Security Specialist with a government agency and in 2009 he returned from an assignment as a Force Protection/Anti-terrorism Officer in Afghanistan. Jamie Jackson will be guest lecturer on trauma care. Jamie has 44 years Health Care experience, former EMT, former Corpsman (73-82) RN, BSN, CCRN 35 years. 25 years Critical Care and ER mostly in New Orleans, full time ER 11 years. TNCC (Trauma Nursing Core Course) PHTLS (Pre Hospital Trauma Life Support) BLS, ACLS, PALS, NALS Louisiana State version of CONTOMS. This specialized class deals with solutions to the Active Shooter or the Armed Terrorist on a suicide mission. Originally designed as a class to deal solely with the armed terrorist, in answer to student's requests, we have expanded it to also include the active shooter situation as well.On the terrorism issue, government and local law enforcement are training for the inevitable wave of terror attacks. Historically the terrorists have not relied solely on explosives, and may just as likely utilize the tactic of an active shooter. Such situations have already occurred here in the USA as seen by the Beltway Snipers, and the shootings outside CIA headquarters several years ago. Similarly, we hear more and more daily about non-terrorist incidents like the Tacoma Mall Shooting where an individual decided to get noticed by killing innocent people in a large public place. Although the authorities may be prepared to respond to such events, history tells us that the first line of defense is the armed citizen. It is the man or woman who finds themselves suddenly and unexpectedly in such an event that will end the killing. Will you be ready?These events, whether begun by a terrorist, or a deranged criminal bent on killing innocents call for new tactics and a new mindset. In the Terrorism/Active Shooter Interdiction Course© you will learn extremely aggressive CQB Interdiction Techniques utilized successfully against terrorists by armed citizens overseas. You will study the possible role of the CCW Armed Citizen in stopping such an event in its tracks. You will learn to use whatever you have at your disposal (pistol, knives, impact weapons and even your bare hands) to deanimate and neutralize a terrorist, or active shooter and stop him from killing innocents.We will also be doing a module of instruction for familiarization with the AK-47 series of rifles and the SKS series of rifles. If you have one, bring it.This course uses live fire, and non-live fire force on force training along with other modalities to develop the necessary aggressive fighting skills and then test them in scenarios replicating actual events. Armed Citizens are the first line of defense and the true Homeland Security. In the Al Queda video tape (which all students will view as a part of the class) the jihadists are training to attack and kill Americans at home. They are ready. Are you?? CLASS AND RANGE DETAILS DURATION: 3 days TIME: 8:30AM to 4:30PM AMMUNITION: Approximately 500 rounds (Minimum) RANGE & GEAR REQUIREMENTS: Pistol, carry holster, at least two magazines, and the usual range safety gear (ear and eye protection). Bring an airsoft pistol with the necessary gear (pellets, facemask, etc - all of it is available at www.onesourcetactical.com. NOTE: Bring an adequate supply of CO2 for the airsoft. An extra magazine is important in case there is a problem with the primary. Also Helpful Bring spare clothing appropriate for the weather, including a hat, sunscreen, and bug repellent. Plan to bring lunch, snacks, and water (min 1 gallon per person) for the entire day unless driving to lunch is a viable option from the range location. Bring allergy medication (if needed), a chair (if you prefer), note taking supplies, and a boo boo kit (band aids, gauze pads, antiseptic wipes, antibiotic ointment and tape). You may wish to bring pads such as knee pads, elbow pads, and gloves if the class lends itself to that. For more info and to register...https://suarezinternational.com/hro-...017-dayton-tn/