Posting at library in Jackson because of HCP

[mac12]

A HCP person asked the manager of a branch library in Jackson if they could carry in the city library. The manager gets all upset and contacts police. They tell the manager to post "No Guns" sign. Another example of the "Don't ask and don't tell" policy. :mad:http://www.jacksonsun.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/200804030520/NEWS01/8040303

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[saintsfanbrian]

But is it a legally posted sign? If not you can ignore it.

[Guest db99wj]

But is it a legally posted sign? If not you can ignore it.

It's hard to tell, there is a lot of writing below the circle/slash part of the sign.

That lady that they interviewed......baaaaaa.

"I don't know why anybody should bring a gun in here," said Sinclair, 45, of Jackson. "It makes sense, but I don't know why you would have to spell it out."

Janice Henry said she had noticed the signs in recent weeks when she stopped by for reference material for her management class.

She said she has never worried about someone bringing a gun into the library, but understands why the signs were posted.

"Obviously people shouldn't bring guns to places like this building, but they do," said Henry, 45, also from Jackson.

Edited April 3, 2008 by db99wj

[Guest dotsun]

Another moron that just restricted a place to legally carry because of his big mouth.

[Fallguy]

There is a picture of the sing in the article, but it's not clear enough to make out. But it looks like it has a whole lot more wording than "no guns" If was to guess they just looked up 39-17-1359 and copied and pasted it into a sign.

But I agree...WHY would you ask.... It is so hard to believe the amount of people that come out of a HCP class and don't know where they can and can not carry.

Anyway.....:wall:

[Guest GUTTERbOY]

"I don't know why anybody should bring a gun in here," said Sinclair, 45, of Jackson. "It makes sense, but I don't know why you would have to spell it out."

Janice Henry said she had noticed the signs in recent weeks when she stopped by for reference material for her management class.

She said she has never worried about someone bringing a gun into the library, but understands why the signs were posted.

"Obviously people shouldn't bring guns to places like this building, but they do," said Henry, 45, also from Jackson.

Ah, a textbook example of anti blather.

"No one should bring a gun in a place like this!"

But ask them to clarify what "a place like this" is, and why it's a worse place for a marauding firearm than the building next door, and it's time to go in circles. The weird thing is that as far as I can tell, it makes sense in their mind. They can't enumerate any logical reason for it, but that's beside the point to them. In the end, it comes down to "That's just the way I feel!" or "You're impossible to reason with!"

Hello, pot? This is kettle calling.

[Fallguy]

You know in my frustration at the HCP holder asking the manager....I forgot to mention the Jackson PD's hand in this.

From reading he article the Library manager simply called the PD to ask what the law is. So instead of tell her there is no law that prevents carry in a library they tell her to put up a sign! Why didn't they just tell her what the law is, why do LEO's all so often feel the need to give their opinion when not asked for?!

Maybe some of you want to ask Chief Staples why his Dept is anti carry. I'm afraid I would end up saying something that would get me barred from Jackson....not that I go to Mini-Memphis that often anyway.

http://www.cityofjackson.net/departments/police/index.html

[strickj]

This guys HCP should be revoked for such stupidity

Edit:removed bad joke

Edited April 3, 2008 by strickj

[Fallguy]

The same reason you feel the need to give your opinion when not ask for

Oh snap!

Ummm...I thought most of the time a post to this board was an invite for the opinions of all members of the board. If mine aren't welcome I can simply lurk unless specifically addressed.

[molonlabetn]

We don't know if the Library manager didn't ask for the opinion of the officer regarding how to keep HCP holders from carrying there.

I'd like to think that he asked what the law was... but it's more likely that his question was a "what should I do", instead of "what is the law".

Opinions are like farts... everybody likes their own brand, and nobody can do anything about it once it's been made public.

[Fallguy]

You are right molonlabetn. We really don't know exactly what was asked....and if the reported did, that doesn't mean they would have printed it exactly they way it was asked. The manager very well could have asked what to do to keep guns out.

I also apologize to strickj, I know he was kidding and he and I have poked fun at each other before.

I'm not sure why, but I have let this get under my skin a little. Not sure why, I don't really go to the library and if I did it wouldn't be in Jackson, but for some reason I had to, I'd just go to the main branch. But it has just hit me wrong all the same. Maybe I've just recovered from all the hits that have come our way from Nashville lately....

[strickj]

Ummm...I thought most of the time a post to this board was an invite for the opinions of all members of the board. If mine aren't welcome I can simply lurk unless specifically addressed.

I apologize,it was just a bad joke.

And I to am kinda mad at this,even though I dint do go to any libraries,period,but its the point of it I guess

[enfield]

They took care of this problem in Michigan a few years ago. After shall-issue was passed, several cities started posting all city offices and parks. The legislature responded with an amendment to the pre-emption law that retroactively prohibited the posting of public property that wasn't already covered by another statute (such as post offices, court rooms and schools).

Once we get rid of Naifeh we can try to get some reasonable laws passed in Tennessee too.

[jughead]

if there is no sign and i know within reason that the law doesnt apply i just keep my mouth shut.

[Marswolf]

Around here, the Library Board would have to make the decision to post. I wonder if the manager has that authority?

[Fallguy]

Around here, the Library Board would have to make the decision to post. I wonder if the manager has that authority?

I have wondered about that myself, especially since it seem the manager at the main branch says he is not going to post a sign, unless asked.

Of course I'm sure he's been asked by now. Anybody know and Jackson Library board members?

[Bocephus]

I live in Jackson and I am hating it more and more. I wish the guy would have kept his mouth shut and did a little research on his own hell he was at the library.

[Guest kwikrnu]

I don't understand what the problem is. I didn't even think I was allowed to carry in the library. Isn't it a government building that is off limits anyway?

As far as signage. I didn't think there was a specific signage that is to be used. It just has to be visible. I never carry if I see signage because if you see signage or know it is off limits to carry in a specific place and the police are called on you you may lose your license.

[Guest dotsun]

All government buildings aren't off limits and signs must conform to TCA 39-17-1359. http://www.michie.com/tennessee/lpext.dll?f=templates&fn=main-h.htm&cp=

[Fallguy]

I don't understand what the problem is. I didn't even think I was allowed to carry in the library. Isn't it a government building that is off limits anyway?

As far as signage. I didn't think there was a specific signage that is to be used. It just has to be visible. I never carry if I see signage because if you see signage or know it is off limits to carry in a specific place and the police are called on you you may lose your license.

You are wrong on several counts.

1. Not all government buildings are off limits. Never have been. Only Federal buildings, state and local government buildings must post a sign to prevent carry.

2. The signage does have to be worded "substantially similar" to the language in 39-17-1359 (as dotsun posted) and must be placed at every entrance to the property or part of the property that carry is to be off limits. It can't just say "No Guns" or something like that. Also see TN AG Opinion 07-43

3. There are certain violations where you can lose your license (39-17-1352), but the officer on the scene can not take it (TN AG Opinion 05-154)

[Marswolf]

Voldemort, it's a common mistake. In addition to what has been posted, carrying in a posted location is not generally a reason for you to lose your HCP. Just a $500 fine, but you keep your license. Just curious, where did you get your info? Serious.

I think I may write to the Jackson County Library Board, as past chairman of the Sullivan County Board. Just a friendly letter explaining why decided to not post the libraries in our county, and why they are idiots to have that policy.

Just kidding about that idiot part. People just don't think it through.

I may want to pass a preview of the letter by our members here.

Edited April 5, 2008 by Marswolf

[Fallguy]

I think I may write to the Jackson County Library Board, as past chairman of the Sullivan County Board. Just a friendly letter explaining why decided to not post the libraries in our county, and why they are idiots to have that policy.

I may want to pass a preview of the letter by our members here.

Great idea!!

[Guest kwikrnu]

You are wrong on several counts.

1. Not all government buildings are off limits. Never have been. Only Federal buildings, state and local government buildings must post a sign to prevent carry.

2. The signage does have to be worded "substantially similar" to the language in 39-17-1359 (as dotsun posted) and must be placed at every entrance to the property or part of the property that carry is to be off limits. It can't just say "No Guns" or something like that. Also see TN AG Opinion 07-43

3. There are certain violations where you can lose your license (39-17-1352), but the officer on the scene can not take it (TN AG Opinion 05-154)

Thank you for posting that. I have not been active on any gun sites in a couple of years. I really appreciated the AG's opinion written on April 7, 2007.

[Guest kwikrnu]

Voldemort, it's a common mistake. In addition to what has been posted, carrying in a posted location is not generally a reason for you to lose your HCP. Just a $500 fine, but you keep your license. Just curious, where did you get your info? Serious.

Like I said the laws and opinions on this seem to change. I remember reading code a few years ago which prohibited carry in government buildings. I also remember reading that public parks were prohibited and I distinctly remember that signage was not necesary. I'll try to look up the code.

[Marswolf]

Yeah, the public park think is confused. I think they have to post, the Attorney General can't read the law and thinks they don't have to post.

But you can definitely carry in the library unless it is properly posted (the slash-gun sign won't do).

Edited April 5, 2008 by Marswolf