Sandy hook conspiracy? (Bring your tin foil hat)

[Seabeejason]

I remain neutral on this.  I choose not to believe that this is a conspiracy.  I just can't do it.  There is simply not enough hard core evidence that suggests this was all a hoax.  I admit that the Facebook pages going up a few days before the shooting is something that is very alarming, but who is to say that this is not fabricated as well? Emily Parker's father laughing and cutting up just before the interview isn't normal to me, but I am not a shrink either.  I can't imagine how I would cope with the loss of my child.  People deal with things in different ways.  

 

What I do know is this.  The Liberals in government are definitely using this to enact sweeping gun controls and potential bans.  They are also wanting to create a "national database" (registration).  We all know what this means.  This event is now behind us and we have to deal with the repercussions.  Whether you believe this shooting happened or not, the rest of America believes it.  We have to fight the machine that has now mobilized against the 2nd Amendment and the rest of our Constitution.  The fight is here regardless of what you believe.  I am going to meet it head-on and everyone else needs to do the same if we are to keep what we cherish the most......FREEDOM.  Keep your eye on the ball.  Tyrants like distractions.

[East_TN_Patriot]

There were several Facebook pages that showed creation dates of 12/10 on Facebook.  I noticed people were asking about this on 12/14 and their posts were being deleted and eventually the pages were deleted and new ones were created,  Also, the RIP Emile Parker page was created the morning of 12/14 and the first post was from her dad talking about her death.  Who creates a Facebook page for their daughter asking for donations instead of being at the scene trying to figure out what is going on?  A couple hours later it was posted on the same page that the school was on lockdown and they weren't sure if Emile was alive in the school or injured at the hospital.  The timing on a lot of it was just weird.  Call me a tinfoil hat freak all you want.

 

So basically, you believe that this is a vast government conspiracy that involved the murder of innocent children and the organization of hundreds of people, but they were too stupid to pay attention to minor details like that and put up web pages before it happened?  If that's what you want to believe, then have at it, but I wonder if any amount of evidence proving that scenario wrong would ever dissuade you from what you want to believe is true.

 

All that we have here is a crazy guy who killed his mother and other innocent people using a firearm that millions of Americans own and just happens to be one that the left uses as the ultimate symbol of their anti-gun views.  After the event, the media, which is notorious for misinformation and an excessive desire for dramatic and atypical crimes to report on (hence the old saying "if it bleeds, it leads"), and they did exactly what the media does in today's infotainment-telesector: They reported any and all information they could without fact-checking or confirming it, they presented rumor as fact, and filled any gaps with speculation and sensationalized commentary.  Because the crime was committed with a gun, gun control advocates saw it as a tragic event that would be useful for furthering their agenda.  They played on people's emotions, presented even more speculation and commentary as fact, and people ignorant of the issue joined people sympathetic with the issue to demand more gun control.  Politicians who already had sympathies for gun control were more than happy to oblige.  That's all that happened.  No grand conspiracy, no "crisis actors", no NWO.  What we can learn from this is exactly what I've laid out.  Politicians and political activists are more than happy to take advantage of a tragedy to push their agenda, and our media is too unprofessional and irresponsible to provide accurate and unbiased news.  This is not a new trend, but was identified decades ago.  There is a whole theoretical perspective that talks about it called "moral panic".
 

Edited January 14, 2013 by East_TN_Patriot

[BrandonTN]

So basically, you believe that this is a vast government conspiracy that involved the murder of innocent children and the organization of hundreds of people, but they were too stupid to pay attention to minor details like that and put up web pages before it happened?  If that's what you want to believe, then have at it, but I wonder if any amount of evidence proving that scenario wrong would ever dissuade you from what you want to believe is true.
 

All I am saying is a lot of the facts around the entire thing don't make sense to me.  Where are the 600 kids who were evacuated?  Why are there no pictures or video of that?  Where are the ambulances?  In all the pictures I saw, I counted 3 up by the fire station...why are they not down by the school?  When my wife was at VT during the shootings, there were ambulances lined up EVERYWHERE, as well as EMT and Blacksburg is not the biggest town out there.  Newtown definitely seemed a bit short staffed on the responding EMS.  That is all, something just hasn't sat right with me since I first saw Sandy Hook on the news.  

[East_TN_Patriot]

Keep your eye on the ball.  Tyrants like distractions.

 

Yes they do, and it doesn't help when our side spends time and energy on distractions they create on their own.

Edited January 14, 2013 by East_TN_Patriot

[East_TN_Patriot]

All I am saying is a lot of the facts around the entire thing don't make sense to me.  Where are the 600 kids who were evacuated?  Why are there no pictures or video of that?  Where are the ambulances?  In all the pictures I saw, I counted 3 up by the fire station...why are they not down by the school?  When my wife was at VT during the shootings, there were ambulances lined up EVERYWHERE, as well as EMT and Blacksburg is not the biggest town out there.  Newtown definitely seemed a bit short staffed on the responding EMS.  That is all, something just hasn't sat right with me since I first saw Sandy Hook on the news.  

 

 

 

Video here:

http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/14/us/connecticut-school-shooting/index.html

http://youtu.be/EUKdLQ0_IEw

 

http://youtu.be/JUPuH184CuU

Of course, people are saying that all of this is fake because there wasn't video or photographs of the incident while it unfolded (because every tiny town across the United States has a news helicopter in the air 24/7 and we all know how the police always let the media run past a crime scene perimeter to get footage), but that's totally up to you to decide. 

 

[Glenn]

I'm not saying this is some kind of conspiracy, but some things seem strange. I also find it strange that some people accuse anyone that questions the official version of anything of being "tin foil hat" I guess the whole fast and furious affair is just tin foil hat stuff. The Benghazi attack is just tin foil hat stuff too. After all, the Libs say so.

[RichardR]

I'm not saying this is some kind of conspiracy, but some things seem strange. I also find it strange that some people accuse anyone that questions the official version of anything of being "tin foil hat" I guess the whole fast and furious affair is just tin foil hat stuff. The Benghazi attack is just tin foil hat stuff too. After all, the Libs say so.

History is ripe with all sorts of conspiracy's, false-flag operations & manufactured crisis, whether or not Sandyhook is yet another example of one of these is way above & beyond my paygrade.

The motivating factors behind the vast majority of these sorts of things is almost always CONTROL, POWER &/or MONEY.

For the folks who don't think hundreds or even thousands of people can keep a secret? Well you would be very mistaken, again all you have to do is open a history book or two, plenty of examples of massive "secret" plans/projects/conspiracy's, etc, involving thousands, even tens of thousands of people who some how were either ideologically driven, economically driven or fearfully driven to keep their mouths shut.

Was Sandyhook was a real event or a staged one? I personally believe that it really happened, but I suppose it is possible that it could have been staged.

If you believe that it would be impossible for our government to even consider, let alone do such a thing, you might want to educate yourself on just how dirty our government is willing to get its hands if they believe that the ends justify the means.

Do yourself a favor by researching the now declassified "Operation Northwoods", which was drafted way back in 1962 & authorized by the Joint Chiefs of Staff.

It is a serious eye opener to anyone & everyone who likes to "tin-foil hats!" the very possibility of members of our own government being involved in something like what happened at Sandyhook.

[Keyless]

I also believe it happened . I however am not sure as to who did it , if he acted alone , what he or they did it with and so on. I believe we get told what they ( The Government ) wants us to believe. I do not believe the "facts" add up and something seems to be off .

 

In December of 1978 the House Select Commitee on Assassinations finally said there was a second gunman and more than 3 shots in the JFK assassanation. Too much evidence to prove that the original story didn't add up. This happened because We the people kept searching for the truth !! I guess it is also known as polihing our tin hat .

 

 I do not think it is wrong to question the facts in any event and no matter WHO is telling the facts. The Government is not above suspicion just because they release the "facts" . If you don't question the Government then you must believe , that these guns are the problem and without guns no murders will happen and slick Willie didn't have sex with that women. The evidence must be overwhelming but they have had to change the official story on events before. That means the official story was not correct or a lie either to protect someone or cover there onwn butt or just that we couldn't know the truth .

 

Never said it didn't happen , I am not sure it happened exactly like we are told it happened. There is a big difference in not believing it happend and not believing it happened like we are told it did. Not saying the Government is or is not involved or did or didn't know about it ahead of time. I am saying that when you leave so many unanswered questions in the minds of so many and give facts that change so many times before the "official" story is agreed upon , then you do nothing but create the breeding ground for the conspiracy theories.

 

 A large part of the problem in my OPINION is the media!! Plain and simple , they try to be the first with "the breaking news" , the new updated facts and so on that they don't seem to care as much about accurate facts as they do about keeping you on their channel for the ratings .  Sometimes there is very little, if any truth in the facts we are told by the media . Figures don't lie but liers figure. If they can twist some fact to fit their agenda , they will . For example , Fact  , x number of gun murders in Britian last year .That number x is a true fact but the truth we need to know is  " if you remove as many guns as you can over a 15 year period GUN murders will go down but did MURDER go down . How many murders were committed last year? You have only removed 1 tool used to commit the act . If guns were banned  , how did you have any gun murders at all ?

 

 I think it is healthy to ask questions no matter who is giving the story. View the evidence and do your own resaerch until you have your questions answered to what you can accept as the truth or in some cases to the point you realize that there is not enough facts available to come to a deffinite conclusion . I do not have to accept any version of any event just because whoever said it happened that way . I don't want anyone to accept what I say on anything . Do some research because if you are reading this , you have access to a computer .

 

 If this makes me a tin hat person , then so be it. Give me a membership card and some Brasso , I got some polishing to do .

Edited January 14, 2013 by Keyless

[BrandonTN]

Ah yes, the famous elephant walk picture of a handful of kids.  I still need to see like 590 more.  2 Ambulances...great response effort there!

 

"Source confirms gunman's father found dead in NJ"...great reporting there as well.

 

Thanks for posting the pictures, but I have seen all those before and I still have my doubts.  If you want to belittle me for questioning authority and the mainstream media, then so be it.  I have always liked doing my own research on things and not just taking what is shoved down my throat as fact.

Edited January 14, 2013 by BrandonTN

[TMF]

Man, this thread gets me wondering what folks would say if 9/11 happened while Obama was in office.  Dear God people, is every tragedy going to be turned into a sinister plot just because you don't like who is in the White House?  I'm embarrassed to have even seen this thread here.

[Guest 6.8 AR]

Explain how exactly.

 

Are they the know-all, end-all, be-all in truth seeking?  Of course not, but no single source is.  However, they do provide sources for reference so you can do your own fact-checking to compare with their fact-checking, which is what every single one of us should be doing anyhow.  Any site that doesn't completely confirm the "facts" as conservatives see them is automatically labeled as having a liberal bias and full of lies.  While the political right is saying Snopes, Fact-check, and Politifact have a liberal bias, people on the left are complaining they have a conservative bias (don't take my word for it, do your own web searches and see for yourself).  Just because the main authors live in Los Angeles does not mean they are automatically liberals, nor does being a liberal automatically mean everything they say is a lie.

How, exactly? I can't prove too much about a web page that claims to be a fact checker any more than I can find my own

answers. The same way you do. I don't rely on someone else's opinion to make something fact. The internet is full of this crap

and people fall for it until they don't have a clue what something is or is not.  On their latest version of their "about us" page

they use FactCheck.org to dispel the myth(whatever) that they are not politicially motivated one way or another. Go check out

FactCheck.org. It will lead you to places like Center for American Progress, FactCheck has always had a liberal bias since they

are owned and operated and were started by liberals for media disinformation. Oh, MediaMatters.org. If you accept those folks

for your facts what's to discuss? They have been outed even in the news.

 

I remember hearing from friends in emails about certain facts verified or shot down by snopes years ago, and never paid much

attention, usually to those who would assume something to be the truth just because someone like that said it. I dig for my own

answers, not because Fox said it, either, but certainly because snopes.com said it, being some kind of authority they themselves

claim to be.

 

I know you're not a liberal, and I know since you got your doctorate, you know how to research something, and I know you wouldn't

use a source like that to document any paper you wrote. Anything that leads to those places makes me suspect and I won't go near

them because of it, just like I won't go to HuffPo, because they are primarily no better than the CBS Evening News, who quit doing

the news before I was born. Propaganda comes in all forms. Even from the right, friend, just not necessarily as blatant.

 

When I wear a hat, it is usually a fedora, not tinfoil.

[Guest 6.8 AR]

Man, this thread gets me wondering what folks would say if 9/11 happened while Obama was in office.  Dear God people, is every tragedy going to be turned into a sinister plot just because you don't like who is in the White House?  I'm embarrassed to have even seen this thread here.

I'm not embarrassed to see it. Information should be sorted out to get to the truth. I don't know what to say, but I will always look at some of it, if it looks credible. I haven't seen anything that makes me think there was some kind of conspiracy. The only thing making me suspect, always, is that timing sure is convenient for all these events taking place, but that is it. But I'm not in a position to say anything further.

 

The trouble with conspiracies, and their detractors, are that there will always be someone who will jump at the thought of something being one. There are those on the other side who will always say these people are just as crazy as the event itself. It's somewhere in the middle is all I can say. And just because something is put up on a web page doesn't give it instant credibility as fact, but there sure are a bunch of folks who will accept it without questioning it. On so-called hard news, which Sandy Hook proved the hard news failed miserably, and led to a lot of this stuff. And that leads me to think about how many times the so-called hard news was flat out wrong. If you don't question what you see and hear, you are the fool, not them. They're just the messenger.

 

I also find it puzzling why many people allow the media, period, to influence them when they are so obvious in their slant on political issues, but that puzzle will turn into a maze with me. There must be a bunch of just plain dumb people watching. Orwell was a liberal who warned of this, wasn't he? Must have been before the commies dug in and infected them all.

Edited January 14, 2013 by 6.8 AR

[TMF]

I also find it puzzling why many people allow the media, period, to influence them when they are so obvious in their slant on political issues, but that puzzle will turn into a maze with me.

 

Yep.  Of course there is a slant, and from the moment this story broke liberal media was already pushing the hi-cap mag and assault rifle agenda.  Got it.

 

One thing that can't be slanted is the death toll.  Those kids are dead and that lunatic shot them.  In order for either of those two facts in my previous sentence to be false it would require no less than 300-400 people to be in on the conspiracy.  Can you find that many people who can keep a secret, especially such a lucrative one?

 

I tell you what, for those who think this is such a big conspiracy that these parents are just actors and these kids never existed I have a challenge for you.  Go and seek out these families you claim are falsely grieving for the cameras.  Seek them out and tell them to their face that they are actors all a part of some conspiracy.  If you aren't willing to do that then STFU.  I can't even fit into my head what it's like to lose a child, let alone be accused of being part of some insanely impossible conspiracy to take away your guns. 

Edited January 14, 2013 by TMF

[Guest 6.8 AR]

I'm not claiming any of that, except for the one video I saw, and, for the life of me, I don't know why anyone would have gone

in front of the camera. If one of mine was killed like that, I wouldn't have gotten anywhere near a camera. I would have told anyone

from the news to leave.

 

I just won't be put in front of the news for something like that. They died. It's an atrocity. I agree. I got it, too, but the piranhas can swim somewhere else.

 

I never said I bought into any conspiracy, but I am always am skeptical about some things. The media didn't get much more right on this for days after the event. They were tripping over themselves reporting speculation, when they should have been reporting what they knew. First things out of their mouths was a damned particular type of weapon. Like that matters.

 

And the fact that they were kids doesn't change anything from other deaths, does it? What about all the gang deaths in Chicago during the same time. Wasn't it a similar number? Maybe more. And look at their gun control. I'm sorry those kids got in the way of a crazy young man with guns, but there is more to it than that. Actually may not be more than that.

 

I know there will never be consistency in news reporting and when kids are the victims they are sensationalized, usually for these reasons, also. My point about the whole mess is, you allow bad law, you end up with these types of consequences.

 

Maybe I've become too cynical myself, but this atrocity should have been reported and handled differently. I didn't even know of it until a couple days later. Don't watch the news much anymore, but it was still not reporting, just narrative.

Edited January 14, 2013 by 6.8 AR

[Guest 6.8 AR]

I do not put myself in front of the public for anyone's benefit. It is rude, disrespectful and any entertainment factor these

types choose to parade in front of the camera shows their disdain for the public. It's not like there's some "15 minutes

of fame" involved in someone's, especially a loved one's death. There used to be some semblance of respect given.

 

Now, it's all show, 24/7/365.

[TMF]

I'm not claiming any of that, except for the one video I saw, and, for the life of me, I don't know why anyone would have gone

in front of the camera. If one of mine was killed like that, I wouldn't have gotten anywhere near a camera. I would have told anyone

from the news to leave.

 

I just won't be put in front of the news for something like that. They died. It's an atrocity. I agree. I got it, too, but the piranhas can swim somewhere else.

 

I never said I bought into any conspiracy, but I am always am skeptical about some things. The media didn't get much more right on this for days after the event. They were tripping over themselves reporting speculation, when they should have been reporting what they knew. First things out of their mouths was a damned particular type of weapon. Like that matters.

 

And the fact that they were kids doesn't change anything from other deaths, does it? What about all the gang deaths in Chicago during the same time. Wasn't it a similar number? Maybe more. And look at their gun control. I'm sorry those kids got in the way of a crazy young man with guns, but there is more to it than that. Actually may not be more than that.

 

I know there will never be consistency in news reporting and when kids are the victims they are sensationalized, usually for these reasons, also. My point about the whole mess is, you allow bad law, you end up with these types of consequences.

 

Maybe I've become too cynical myself, but this atrocity should have been reported and handled differently. I didn't even know of it until a couple days later. Don't watch the news much anymore, but it was still not reporting, just narrative.

 

 

We fill up just about every thread with how effed up the media is.  I don't think anyone with half a brain could disagree.  But whether this was done with a gun, airplane, scissors or a slap chop, it would still be top news for a significant period of time.  The difference between this and the collective gang violence in all the major cities is that this was one event, carried out by one person. 

 

The news is designed to sell.  If the news ran the top story of a kid being killed by gang violence every single day, people would get sick of reading it and stop buying that paper or clicking on that link.  For example, people finally got tired of seeing grief stricken parents paraded across the TV and tuned out, so now they aren't doing that anymore.  Now it's strictly about agenda. 

 

I don't think I can find anything in your post that I disagreed with, especially the part about folks getting their 15 minutes of fame due to a tragedy.  I remember seeing some 8 year old on the news the day of the shooting and he's describing the event.  What f***ing parent would allow that to happen???  What parent would want their child to relive that moment again on national television before they've even had a chance to get him home, decompress and hug him like you'd never let him go?  Yeah, it disgusts me too.

 

But what really, really disgusts me is when someone uses this tragedy as a political tool (on either side) and starts spouting conspiracy and accusing parents (who have lost their children) of being in on it.  Absolutely disgusting.  The same as those disgusting wastes of oxygen that accused 9/11 victims' families being in on the conspiracy, as if all the people on those planes are living in Tahiti now.  That's what makes me mad.  I hope to God that none of the low lives accusing these parents ever have to experience the grief of losing a child, but if they did I bet they wouldn't be saying what they're saying right now.

Edited January 14, 2013 by TMF

[Guest 6.8 AR]

I feel the same way as you, TMF. And I hope that you didn't confuse me with being a conspiracy theorist. I only stated one

video before, and I was disgusted with that. I can't even think of words to describe my attitude about how people behave

in front of the media. I don't intend to ever use something like this as something to describe a plot of some kind. The media

does that well enough on their own.

 

Yeh, I thought the 9/11truthers, whatever they are called, were a bit over the top. More distaste. The world has changed a

lot since I've been in it. Too much. But don't shut out the idea that some things can happen due to nefarious people. Our

history is full of examples of things that look like, and some were conspiracies. The word is overused to the point it's original

meaning has been changed into something it was never intended. Every time two people come up with a plot to do something,

good or evil, that's a conspiracy. The word has been placed into "fringe" status. The American Revolution was a conspiracy.

[TMF]

I didn't. 

 

I feel the same way as you, TMF. And I hope that you didn't confuse me with being a conspiracy theorist.

[Guest carter]

we only know what the news is telling us about this event... and we all  believe what ever the news reports, right? that's the only evidence we have at this point... and Mr. Parker the actor...i agree he is shady and screams fraud... i have learned thru the years the only true evidence is whats physically in front of me... like in court... so do i believe it happened (( shurgs )) who knows unless i actually go up there and see for myself.

 

I'm sitting right now watching the presidential new conference... its funny this shooting has sparked a frenzy, what about the theater shooting? why didn't that spark a craze buying spree... makes u think a little though... the president said he was going to try and bypass congress and push thru executive order measures that would make it hard for criminals to have guns... I'd like to see what that is... being the individual that shot up the school wasn't a criminal until he shot his mother and killed her... you can not stop someone that is a total angel on paper from doing something off the charts crazy like mass shootings... its impossible... no one knows when or where it will happen, hints why i carry every where i go...

Edited January 15, 2013 by carter

[Guest AmericanWorkMule]

So if its a conspiracy...what would the desired result be? A ploy organized to give further ammunition to ban guns? Or what.

 

 

just like Operation Fast and Furious . . .?

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oNfSsP3A_0w

Edited January 14, 2013 by AmericanWorkMule

[GlockSpock]

Just caught a snippet on Fox about an upcoming segment on (I believe) a professor catching flack over claiming that Sandy Hook was staged. Should be interesting to watch if you can catch it.

[ProjectDexter]

http://tv.naturalnews.com/v.asp?v=2E10716E6FD870ADECD5461A6778F3AB

NBC later scrubbed this to fall in line with what the other broadcasts were being told to say. Edited January 14, 2013 by ProjectDexter

[Keyless]

 I see two choices either this is correct and the others are wrong or the others are correct and this one is wrong . You can't have it both ways . I mean here is NBC news saying one thing totally different from the others . This is not Joe Bob repoting for  some rag paper here . If NBC can't get it right then who are we supposed to listen to for the FACTS .  I see unanswered questions still.

Edited January 14, 2013 by Keyless

[Keyless]

TMF

 

As for 9-11

 

  Doesn't matter to me who is president , the questions would be the same . How did the passport get to the gound , out of the plane ,soaked in jet fuel and not burn up ? Why did building 7 fall in its own footprint when it was not hit by a plane ? why did the plastic I D card survive the Pentagon crash ? and Why was there no piece bigger than a phonebook left at the PA crash? Same questions I have had for years . 

 

 Remember that this country keeps electing the lesser of 2 evils. So we still have eveil in high offices no matter who wins , we lose . To what degree they will go to get what they want is something I don't know . You can't believe two totally different stories as fact. One has to be incorrect either by error and not having done thier homework or an intentional attemp to make us believe what they want us to . That is were the individual has to do some research and come to their own conclusions.

Edited January 14, 2013 by Keyless

[Keyless]

I just watched the video of officers pulling a " long gun " from the trunk of the black vehicle and clearing the chamber . 

 

The video is titled

 

Police Find Long Gun in Trunk Of Car In Sandy Hook Parking Lot : Newtown Connecticut School Shooting

 

About 1:22 long and it is NBC news but they now say 2 handguns . Also notice that it is dark outside , That seems strange to me .  I don't know how to post the link here .

 

 I am again Not saying

 

It did not happen !! The Government Did or didn't do it or did or didn't know it was going to happen !! That we are questioning if the parent lost a child or not .

 

I am saying that the Facts don't add up to me!!! Period !!! Something is not right, if nothing other than someone is altering the facts to fit their needed agenda. Yes it is a terrible event but it needs to be reported with true facts . We need to know what is really going on not what some one ( not sure who ) wants us to believe .