chances R

Hope you like ORANGE,,.........

You can get a lot of practice by simply using "Dry Practice".  Safe gun handling, presentation, re-holster,sight alignment, trigger press can all be done without firing a shot.  This all carries over to the range and maximizes your ammo when you can get to the range.  Don't short change yourself.....do it routinely.

teecro.........please re-read my post and point out where I supported MANDATORY training or state fees.

Open or concealed, someone who assumes the responsibility of carry should get some basic training.  Anyone who assumes that the HCP course is training is fooling themselves.  Problem is I don't trust the general population to act responsibly, as I have already seen how most who get their HCP end their 'training' there.

SHOWS 349  for me as well.

or here:http://www.tngunowners.com/forums/topic/74804-taurus-and-im-not-happy/   IMO you can't go wrong with the M&P shield

I have to strongly disagree about ignoring the penetration issue.  Several studies in NY and elsewhere were used to move toward HP ammo.  In fact, some experts in court have brought up the issue of negligence if one ignores this issue.  Just recently saw a 45 FMJ shatter a bone, exit, and went who knows where.  But not saying HP wouldn't, but I bet it slows down more, and weighs less on exit.  In this case, good for the good guy as he was the one shot.  Missing with any round will not help your legal standing,......over penetration is another issue and always a consideration in weapon and ammo choices.

I have been using a 12# Lortone tumbler for the past 3 years.  Bought it used off Ebay.  I load it up with a quart zip lock bag of cases (I only do 45 and 9s).  Set it on a timer for at least 4 hrs.  Sometimes let it go 8 hrs if I put a load in before work.  Nothing cleans better that I have seen.  Still using the same SS media I bought initially for $30.  I use 1 teaspoon Lemishine and about the same of Armor All Wash and Wax.  The latter rinses much easier that dawn, etc.  I rinse it off, put it in the separator, poor it into a wire basket, put it in the clothes dryer on the shoe rack for 20 minutes and it is done.  I have done thousands of rounds, the tumbler still is going strong (http://www.lortone.com/midsize_tumblers.html).  Note that the inside of the bucket should have fins or scalloped to be the most effective in tumbling.

Not only less effective, but more dangerous to the public in general.  More likely to 'shoot through'.  So, in a round-about-way, a ruling favorable for the law-breaking scumbags, and a more dangerous environment for the law-abiding citizens.  The whole freaking world is upside down.

  Hiding under a chair is NOT a good idea if Christie will be sitting on it.. :cool:

One such scenario occurred several years ago.  Active shooter at a IHOP rest.  Shot a couple of people in a parking lot, then went inside and shot some National Guard troops having breakfast, best I recall.  There was a witness across the street, had a HCP and weapon available.  Didn't take any shots for various and 'I don't remember" reasons.  But anyhow, that is a situation where some long-range shots could have been useful.

I have a friend, whose wife's cousin knew someone that worked at a place where there would be a verbal confrontation or telephone threat from a customer. Although at that particular workplace there is a 'no firearms' policy. However whenever such a threat is made, that employee is always asked if he has his weapon in a handy location. Funny how guns are such a bad thing until someone feels they need one.

One can also practice malfunction drills and reloads.  Use dummy, inert ammo and a par timer with a buzzer.  Also remember you need perfect practice.  Practicing sloppy technique will only make you perfect at being sloppy.  Slow is smooth.....smooth is fast.

You think maybe they 'see the light'.  This AND they fired Piers..............

In this case pretty sure the draw string, and it doesn't limit the problems to Glocks. I had a student yesterday, as he was re-holstering have the draw string trapped by the trigger guard.  I was standing there, stopped the process and made the very point of being sure the garment is cleared.  I don't know that anyone even uses the draw string much, so cut 'em off  IMO.

As an Instructor, I emphasize the importance of slow and deliberate re-holster.  After all the training and time spent for one to draw and possibly use their firearm, don't be in a hurry to re-holster.  Most NDs happen on the draw or re-holster; so BE CAREFUL.  In this situation the draw string adjustment device caught the trigger.  The victim didn't insure he had cleared his garment.  This can happen with any glock type trigger safety.  Thought you might like to see the video and hopefully prevent a tragedy.   http://www.ignatius-piazza-front-sight.com/2014/03/18/front-sight-blog-video-jacket-drawstrings-causing-glocks-fire/#vid

Similar experience with Frog Lube.  Put it on the 1911's.......and after sitting in the safe for a couple of weeks the slides acted and felt gummy.  F L is fired.  Back to 0/20 W Mobil 1.

Yep, hope they choke on it, along with the others who rip people off.

What has been said regarding 1911's is good advice......however, if you are just wanting a reliable, no-fuss .45 forget the 1911.  Same arguments on why the military went with them vs. the Glock, M&P, or XDs.  Simple, Dependable, and you can buy 2 of  them in your price range.

  Yes, it is helpful and I do the same.  However, it is not a necessity and I would not go to the trouble of trying to make my own.  A little spray of Hornady Case Lube is quite sufficient.

Before I went to my first professional training course, I thought I could shoot a pistol.  I found out I didn't know much at all.  After 4 full days of training, I became a much better gun-handler, safer, knowledgeable, and much more accurate.  Other courses added to all of those facets.  I know I can shoot now, hopefully can react properly to situations that may occur.  But also, one of the best things about the training, they were very enjoyable, and sometimes intense days.  I can say I look forward to professional training as much as I look forward to a fishing or hunting trip or other vacation.

If you are loading 9mm, forget the case lube.....needless steps.

Luke I don't disagree with anything you said. But it would be a mistake to think nobody else can offer similar training at a lesser cost. And that is from personal experience . Cruel hand Luke is just one example.

  this........with Lemi-Shine in the WET rotary tumbler.

I agree that training is essential.  One does not need to spend the kind of money mentioned however.  I have been to other classes for considerably less money.  Tactical Advantage in Knoxville has some very good classes for less than $100/day.  Front Sight can be an excellent experience, especially for a new shooter.  But the point is, get the training