PaiMei

Dr Gary Roberts is a very credible source. Do a search under his user name DocGKR and youll find a lot of stuff. Yes hes a consultant to the joint FBI and USMC munitions testing program and whole hell of alot more. His bio... "Dr. Roberts is currently on staff at Stanford University Medical Center; this is a large teaching hospital and Level I Trauma center were he performs hospital dentistry and surgery. After completing his residency at Navy Hospital Oakland in 1989 while on active military duty, he studied at the Army Wound Ballistic Research Laboratory at the Letterman Army Institute of Research and became one of the first members of the International Wound Ballistic Association. Since then, he has been tasked with performing military, law enforcement, and privately funded independent wound ballistic testing and analysis. He remains a Navy Reserve officer and has recently served on the Joint Service Wound Ballistic IPT, as well as being a consultant to the Joint FBI-USMC munitions testing program and the TSWG MURG program. He is frequently asked to provide wound ballistic technical assistance to numerous U.S. and allied SOF units and organizations. In addition, he is a technical advisor to the Association of Firearms and Toolmark Examiners, as well as to a variety of Federal, State, and municipal law enforcement agencies. He has been a sworn Reserve Police Officer in the San Francisco Bay Area, where he now he serves in an LE training role." If you want to see his list of pistol ammo look here... http://www.tngunowners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7291&page=2 Also if you want to see his bio and one of his reports on small arms ammo look here... http://www.dtic.mil/ndia/2008Intl/Roberts.pdf I also would dig around on here since you dont have to join... http://www.firearmstactical.com/

So who rated it number one? What research, and in what controlled testing environment was that rating based upon? What specific models and in what calibers did those "proven performers" excel in? What title has the decade old technology held for 4 years?

10mm...

I think you get quite a bit for the money with a Dan Wesson. The Pointman Seven is on my wish list actually.

+1 Id also be willing to meet you guys if your in the Nashville area. Making a first time purchase can be hard as there is a lot of information to digest and lots of options out there. Spending some time "behind the wheel" as Tungsten said might be your best bet. You can get a gun made of solid gold that tucks you in at night.....but that doesn't do you any good if you don't know how to use it properly and lack confidence in it. There are some ranges that have a lot of platforms you can rent and try. See what works for you and your wife.

It just goes to show the importance of test firing ALOT of rounds in a SD pistol (or rifle) to make sure your gun likes to feed, fire and eject them.

Ahhhhhh....then ya just choose from docs list...look on the side of your box and see if it says model... "LE9T1" or "LE9T5." Wait a minute...thats the pic off of mahsupplies.net !!!

If its .45acp your talking about then go here... http://www.tngunowners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12093

I hadn't seen this before....this is freaking hilarious!!!:screwy:

It looks awesome....I particularly love the slide at the top. Plus Chuck approves!

I could be wrong....but I think he means "Officer-Involved." Considering A-LOT of agencies are issuing .40. I also doubt a criminal knows to go buy 180g tactical bonded rounds...but then again, I hear they are buying up those new homeboy nyte sytes to go with their essstendas:)

I never got to meet him in person...but he seemed like such a great guy here...he will truly be missed here. My condolences to his family.

I recently tried to throw out some bait to him on the mp-pistol forum to see if he would bite on this very subject and he did...he said... If your a member there you can find the thread here... http://mp-pistol.com/boards/index.php?showtopic=14891 The .45acp was originally designed for a 5" inch barrel. The rounds on Docs list were tested using a 4.25" inch barrel. 3" is quite significantly shorter and will result in a much slower velocity coming from an already slow round in nature. For SD I wouldn't bother with 3" in .45acp. +1...ya...what he said. Pistols are generally poor incapacitaters.

Those are pretty slim guns...like Tungsten said... get a good quality holster and belt and you should be good to go.

+1

Ya Glock triggers are kinda unique hence why people love them or hate them. Sure....you do have some light uptake before the sudden break...but the beauty of that trigger is how short your reset is. If you really take the time to get used to the reset on the Glock trigger...your follow up shots are going to be quick. The Glock has one of the shortest resets of stuff out there. They are kind of unique...and if you throw them into the mix of other pistols, the grip angle and trigger can take some getting used to. For me...the Glock trigger is one of the reasons I carry one.

If its for carry I would stay away from the boutique ammo makers that make claims of causing internal wounds that leave mushroom clouds over them. I'd stick to something that has been thoroughly tested and proven. IMHO the boutique manufactures don't have the same quality control that the big 3 have...(ATK, Winchester, Remington.) Ya um...I don't think you can change physics with marketing.

Ya I second that. I haven't gotten to fire the .45c yet. But I have fondled it. It appears to me to be the .45 that Glock should have made. Making a Glock 19 in the 45. But instead they gave us the GAP. I have a feeling this is gonna be a good seller for S&W.

Yes the .45c is larger than its 9c and .40c siblings....no its not as big as the full size 9 or 40. Its somewhere in between and I must say is a nice size carry gun.

I think the ability and God given talent is there. Whether or not he shows up on game day or not is another. I really don't know what to think of it all really. That article in the Tennessean on his "emotional" status though is uh...interesting....http://www.tennessean.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080910/SPORTS01/809100426&s=d&page=3#pluckcomments Ya they mention that in the article...no ammo in the car Text from Article : Felicia Young has seen her son experience the ups and downs that go with being a football star. On Monday night, she saw 25-year-old Vince Young sink to his lowest point. It ended with Coach Jeff Fisher calling Metro police to search for her son for over four hours, and opened the biggest window yet into the emotional and troubled side of the Titans quarterback. A psychologist was among those who met with Young at his Brentwood home on Monday, and what she concluded and told team officials led to a bizarre, 24-hour period that ended just after midnight Monday. That's when Fisher met with Young and police at Baptist Sports Park. Felicia Young said her son has grown weary of all the negativity he faces as an NFL star. On Monday, he indicated to those around him he didn't want to play football any more. "Vince has gone through a whole lot as a young person,'' Felicia Young said. "And I think he has done pretty well up to this point. But it is hard, all he is going through right now. He's hurting inside and out. "But he will be fine if people are prayerful and help my baby boy out. He is a young man. He just needs a lot of love and support.'' When the frantic search for Young ended, Fisher and the Titans said the incident had been blown out of proportion. So did some of Young's friends and family. But the events that led up to it all — and the fact Fisher called police — showed just how much concern the team has regarding the mental state of Young, who suffered a left knee injury in Sunday's season-opening victory over the Jaguars. Young opted not to get an MRI of the knee on Monday; an MRI on Tuesday revealed he has a sprained MCL that could keep him out two to four weeks. The Titans, meanwhile, were making plans to go on without him. "In a major city police department we have calls like this all the time about people who fear for their loved ones … the difference here being Vince Young's notoriety,'' Metro police spokesman Don Aaron said. "When the police department gets such calls, you have to take them seriously. You never know how these issues will ultimately turn out. The concerns of (Monday) night appear to be unfounded.'' Doctor Was Concerned The Titans had concerns about Young that began even before late Monday night. After Young balked at having the MRI on Monday, Fisher went out and talked to him at his Brentwood home, spending more than an hour with him. The Titans also sent a psychologist, Dr. Sheila Peters, and Tina Tuggle, the team's Director of Player Development, to meet with Young to try to encourage him. The psychologist said Young was extremely depressed and expressed concerns to the team about Young's safety. Later, Young left the house and sped off in his Mercedes Benz without his cell phone. He couldn't be found for some time, which prompted a phone call to Fisher. Fisher then called police, who began searching for Young. When Young was finally tracked down, he met with Fisher and police at Baptist Sports Park and eventually went home. "The people that are closest to Vince inform(ed) us that he had left his house in a state of mind that had them concerned; and that he was unreachable, having left his cell phone at the house,'' Fisher said in a statement. "(Later) it was determined that those initial concerns by his friends and family were unfounded and he returned home without incident.'' According to police, Young had a handgun in the glove compartment of his vehicle, but it was not loaded and Aaron said officers had no concerns about Young trying to harm himself. Young was not charged with any crime because it's not a violation of the law in Tennessee to transport an unloaded firearm with no ammunition in a motor vehicle. "The fact the gun was in the glove compartment and was unloaded did not present an issue for the officers,'' Aaron said. "There was no ammunition in the car. The slide was back in a safe position, and it was in the glove box.'' Just Watching Football A friend of Young's said on Tuesday the quarterback was with him watching Monday Night Football in Steve McNair's office in Nashville when police were searching for Young, and neither had any idea anyone was looking for him. Earlier, the two had stopped by Nuttin' but Wings on Jefferson Street and exchanged autographs for free wings, Raymond White said. "We sat around watching football and eating chicken wings,'' White said. "Everything was fine. There was no problem.'' Agent Major Adams, who represents Young, said on Tuesday that the quarterback was shocked at all the attention the story generated on Tuesday. "He understands that people care about him and all that; that is the good part of it,'' Adams said. "But to have it all blow up like it was … Vince feels like he can't go anywhere without people knowing where he is 24 hours a day. That's the only negative part of it. He's fine.'' The Future Is Hazy The events of the last 48 hours, however, have clearly left a lasting mark on Young and the Titans. On Sunday, before Young was injured against the Jaguars, he initially refused to re-enter the game after throwing an interception and getting booed by fans. His decision to ignore the team's request for him to have the MRI created even more friction between the player and the team, and indications Tuesday night were that the Titans have turned the team over to back-up quarterback Kerry Collins. Even when Young returns from his injury, he might not get his job back. Then there's the question about whether Young is interested in returning, something he mentioned to those who were with him on Monday. "What would you think, if you were tired of being ridiculed and persecuted and talked about and not being treated very well, what would you do? What kind of decision would you make?'' Felicia Young said. "He may not want to deal with it (all), but you have to get to that point before you make that decision first. "But we're not talking about football right now. We're talking about what would make him happy, and that is the most important thing. "… You don't want people to be hurting like he is. But it is a growing-up process, and he will eventually come out like gold no matter what. But Vince is going to be OK. We are just going to try and give him some space." Reach Jim Wyatt at 259-8015 or jwyatt@tennessean.com.

http://www.tennessean.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080909/COUNTY09/80909020 Text from article: FRANKLIN — County commissioners did not vote on resolution that would have banned guns at all county-owned buildings. Instead, Commissioner Lewis Green, who sponsored the resolution, asked that it be pulled because “of the far reaching implications.†The resolution may be killed for good. “I can promise you it need not come up again,†Commission Chairman Houston Naron Jr. said. Green said he has no intention of bringing the resolution back. Commissioners, who met last night, heard from six residents who opposed the ban, which would have extended to people with handgun carry permits. County resident Kevin Pratt said the resolution was “designed to make people feel safe,†but wouldn’t allow law-abiding citizens to carry firearms in public buildings. Had it been approved, there would have been signs posted at the entrances to every county-owned building, telling people they could be fined $500 for bringing in a gun.

Im in...

Sounds like we need to get something organized...

Same here. Its a sweet little gun...the ergos really fit my hand well and it shot pretty smoothly...BUT...I dont carry, and wont carry a DA/SA pistol. That being said I haven't tried their DAO version, and I have no idea how heavy the pull is...I doubt its any kind of pre cocked system like HK's LEM. Also, I found that the de-cocker wanted to rip the flesh off my hand when racking the slide..but thats just me. Otherwise I thought it was a very underrated pistol.

I think its an excellent pick.