Looking for some good/cheap 148 gr HBWC in 38 special

[BigK]

Seems like there are lots of sites that sell hardcast DEWC bullets, but they aren't any cheaper than HBWC. Besides, everyone I've asked say HBWC are more accurate. Since I'll be reloading them for target/practice, I see no reason to pay more for hardcast bullets just in case I want to push them faster.

So, I've looked around online for some 38 caliber 148 gr HBWC bullets. So far, the best price I've found is on 500 Speer HBWC at MidwayUSA for just over $45 shipped. Naturally, I save more with volume, but I only want 500 to start with.

Anyone know where I can get HBWC bullets any any cheaper?

[dlm37015]

mid south shooters local great folks to deal with .cast your own not too hard hbwc are cast out of softer lead if you want a great close range round load 1 backwards

[BigK]

I'm all for helping the local guys with my business whenever possible, but I'm too cheap in this case. MTS is a full 35% higher.

[dlm37015]

cast your own buy a mould from someplace use wheelweights cast 500 for almost nothing

[BigK]

I may eventually give it go.

[The Man]

Missouri Bullet Company

[Jonnin]

Missouri Bullet Company

This. They are flat nosed, so not exactly a wad cutter, but 500 for $30 is hard to beat and you save on shipping as they use the USPS flat rate boxes, fill one up to save money. I have used their slugs and they are great, a little dinged up and that lube they use has a bad habit of getting onto the bullets in lumps, but those are minor issues for the price and other hard cast have the same issues. The hardness hype is apparently working, I have yet to make a load that "leads" the barrel on my guns, one of which has poly rifling. Sportsmans warehouse has hard cast sometimes in a few calibers, and that can be a deal just because it saves shipping (but costs more) for small purchases. Or a gun show may have a deal as well. I bought .40 cal hard cast at SW because I dont shoot it much and didnt need anything else, the shipping on a small order would have destroyed any savings from an online purchase. True wadcutters are just flat nosed, right? You could probably just seat any round backwards to get that effect if you find a deal on a particular shape of bullet... Edited July 27, 2011 by Jonnin

[I_Like_Pie]

I like mastercast bullets.

mastercast.net

For the price of 1000 anywhere you can almost buy everything you need to cast....Minus some odds and ends. 50 pounds of scrap lead that you get from WW or picking up at the range will cast a LOT of 38 bullets. Alox lube and lee 5-cavity and you don't even have to resize them.

[dlm37015]

the sad thing is wheel weights are no longer lead. the good thing about that is now they are zinc i also cast for my 75mm french rifled cannon

[LngRngShtr]

Haven't dealt with them personally yet but...

Have you looked in your own back yard ? $22.00 for 250 works out to $44.00 for 500 Hornady and I know for a fact the PPC revolvers and S&W M52 's love em...

Champion's Choice - Product Catalog - Pistol Bullets

Champion's Choice, Inc.

201 International Blvd

LaVergne, Tennessee 37086

Edited July 29, 2011 by LngRngShtr

[Dave Shooter]

Have you tried Zero?

Roze Distribution: 38 SPECIAL (.357 DIAMETER)

Under $80/k shipped to your door. If they are out of stock or you still only want 500 to start I may be able to hook you up.

[BigK]

I went with the ones from MidwayUSA. They are good enough for now. I am having trouble getting the roll crimp right. They're cold swaged, so there's no crimp grooves. I'm loading them flush and having trouble with accuracy.

[LngRngShtr]

BigK,

The only way I have been able to get them to work with a roll crimp is to seat them just below flush and substantial roll crimp,..as written in Gil Hebard's "TEST FIRE REPORT" (Gun Digest 1963)

I found measuring how much crimp,..problematic and hard to repeat

I gave up and went with a taper crimp of .370" which he also mentioned and I find for my M52 more consistent in my case loaded with the 2.7 grs. of Bullseye after uniforming the casings to 1.142" Also experimented with WW231 and Hi-Skor 700X and IMR PB powders..all loaded to around 750-850 fps

I also experimented with trimming casings to 1.120" and seating to an OAL of 1.142" as some of the '52s owners have but didn't see that great an improvement, but did speed loaded in my PPC revolver easier it seemed.

What kind of accuracy are you looking for? What problems are you having ? grouping ? key-holing ? these 148's will perform once you find your formula so don't give up hope !

John

P.S. The right formula in a S&W M-52 will net you 10 shot groups in the 2"-3" @ 50 Yards and I have seen a few PPC revolvers do smaller than that under ideal conditions..

Edited August 8, 2011 by LngRngShtr

[BigK]

I was advised by some experienced HBWC reloaders on another forum to I seat flush and roll crimp over the top. l followed this advice and I made 10 rounds with decreasing amounts of crimp. All were loaded with 2.7 gr of Bullseye and CCI primers using once-fired Remington brass.

I fired these at 10 yard at an 8.5"X 11" sheet of paper. Some didn't even hit paper. Since they missed, I couldn't even tell where they went.

I only bought a Lee 3-die set for my turret press instead of a 4-die set. I figured the roll crimp would be best, but now I'm wondering...

Did I over/under crimp? At this distance I can get 2" groups with factory ammo. So, it's not me or my gun this time.

I can pick up a factory taper crimp instead & go with a longer OAL (seated higher). Will this work? Will my brass last longer too?

Edited August 9, 2011 by BigK

[LngRngShtr]

youch,...thats a problem,

seat flush and try taper crimping to 368" to .370"

load development I always do starting with a large target, or large clean target backer (cover backer with butchers paper,cardboard etc. ) who knows one of the loads could have been a tight group 6" left or right and barely missed the paper..

I believe taper crimping makes brass last longer but at these pressures it is a moot point..

Edited August 8, 2011 by LngRngShtr

[BigK]

Here's some pics of some I seated/crimped with no powder. Do any of them look right to you guys? I could sure use some input. These bullets have no grooves, so seating just above the cartridge lip and cripmping seems to be to heavy based on the indention in the lead I see after pulling a bullet.

[LngRngShtr]

too much crimp in my world.. seat the bullets flush with case mouth and roll over edges if you must roll crimp,.. they should look like empty cases when viewed from the side, experiment with degree of crimp from straight edge to as much as you have there with the shorter seating depth,..do not alter the sides of that bullet design it doesn't like you doing that.

[Dave Shooter]

too much crimp in my world.. seat the bullets flush with case mouth and roll over edges if you must roll crimp,.. they should look like empty cases when viewed from the side, experiment with degree of crimp from straight edge to as much as you have there with the shorter seating depth,..do not alter the sides of that bullet design it doesn't like you doing that.

+1

I personally taper crimp just enough to take out bell plus one to two thousanths. Loads are so light you don't have to worry about bullets jumping the crimp if the case is resized properly.

Good Luck!

[dlm37015]

if it ever cools of again i will have to cast this winter you can come over and cast some

[BigK]

too much crimp in my world.. seat the bullets flush with case mouth and roll over edges if you must roll crimp,.. they should look like empty cases when viewed from the side, experiment with degree of crimp from straight edge to as much as you have there with the shorter seating depth,..do not alter the sides of that bullet design it doesn't like you doing that.

+1

I personally taper crimp just enough to take out bell plus one to two thousanths. Loads are so light you don't have to worry about bullets jumping the crimp if the case is resized properly.

I stepped down the crimp to where it just takes the bell out of the case. It looks much better now...can't wait to shoot some this weekend. Thanks for your help guys.

[BigK]

if it ever cools of again i will have to cast this winter you can come over and cast some

I've been wanting to try casting for quite a while. The way I see it, I'd be gaining another level of contol over my own reloading operation. My only holdbacks have been finding material and time to do enough reading up to feel comfortable buying equipment and trying it.