Sale to guy from out of state

[Symbolic]

I searched for this here and didn't find this [u][i]exact[/i][/u] question, but the answers I did find point to NO.

There is a guy from MO who wants to buy my rifle. He said he'll drive to my town to buy it. I told him I wasn't sure if it was legal, but he said he does it all the time and any FTF transaction is legal.

[b]Is it legal to sell a firearm to a resident of another state if they are in my state?[/b]

[Guest nysos]

Has to be shipped to his FFL or driven there by you and transferred if it crosses a state line in terms of ownership.

If he is willing to drive that far to buy a gun f2f, it arises some questions as to why he is willing to do that. Possible he just comes through your area all the time? or possible he can't legally buy a firearm through an FFL and tries to circumvent this?

[Symbolic]

[quote name='OhShoot' timestamp='1351812312' post='837371']
Federal law: you cannot legally sell a firearm of [i]any[/i] type to a resident of another state without going through a FFL. Long guns can be at an FFL in either state, handguns must be at FFL in the buyer's state.

Some states have additional requirements, and NC is one of them. To buy a pistol, buyer must first get a permit to purchase. It's my understanding that a NC carry permit negates that.

- OS
[/quote]

Darn it. Why is it everytime that I search and don't find the answer, I post my question only to find it later after more thorough searching? Can anyone verify this with a source document?

[BryanP]

He is wrong. You can buy a long gun such as your rifle from an FFL in another state. For all other inter-state firearms transactions you must have the gun sent to an FFL in the buyer's state.

Scenario 1: You buy a rifle from Joe's Gun Shop in Kentucky, but you life in Tennessee. Status: perfectly legal.
Scenario 2: You buy a handgun from Joe's Gun Shop in Kentucky, but you life in Tennessee. Status: illegal.
Scenario 3: You buy a rifle OR a handgun from Bill the guy you know in Alabama, but you life in Tennessee. Status: illegal.

edited to correct misinformation, thanks OhShoot for correcting me Edited November 7, 2012 by BryanP

[Symbolic]

nysos, those were my thoughts exactly.

[Oh Shoot]

[quote name='Left2Die762' timestamp='1352312384' post='841141']
I searched for this here and didn't find this [u][i]exact[/i][/u] question, but the answers I did find point to NO.

There is a guy from MO who wants to buy my rifle. He said he'll drive to my town to buy it. I told him I wasn't sure if it was legal, but he said he does it all the time and any FTF transaction is legal.

[b]Is it legal to sell a firearm to a resident of another state if they are in my state?[/b]
[/quote]

You can legally sell a long gun in TN to resident of another state [b]only[/b] by transferring it to him through a TN FFL.

Handguns must be transferred by FFL in buyer's home state.

There are a couple of state exceptions to that, like ILL, where a buyer must have a permit to buy, and a state or two in the NE that only allow adjoining state sales don't know how that translates with FFLs in other states, I suppose the 4473 process catches it. But MO isn't one of them.

- OS Edited November 7, 2012 by OhShoot

[Oh Shoot]

[quote name='BryanP' timestamp='1352312785' post='841151']
He is wrong. You can buy a long gun such as your rifle from an FFL in a state that borders yours.
[/quote]

Only a couple or three states that require that, I think all in NE. There is no federal "adjoining state" law.

- OS

[monkeylizard]

[url="http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/unlicensed-persons.html"]http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/unlicensed-persons.html[/url]

The first few FAQs will confirm what has already been stated here.

[BryanP]

[quote name='OhShoot' timestamp='1352312974' post='841156']
Only a couple or three states that require that, I think all in NE. There is no federal "adjoining state" law.

- OS
[/quote]

Thanks. Learned something new today.

[Symbolic]

Thank you so much guys!

[Oh Shoot]

[quote name='BryanP' timestamp='1352312785' post='841151']
....
Scenario 3: You buy a rifle OR a handgun from Bill the guy you know in Alabama, but you life in Tennessee. Status: illegal.

edited to correct misinformation, thanks OhShoot for correcting me
[/quote]

Also, on #3, if a long gun, you can buy Bill's gun in TN if transferred through TN FFL, or buy it in 'Bama if transferred through 'Bama FFL.

The handgun must be transferred by FFL in the purchaser's state only.

- OS

[Symbolic]

This is what the guy just sent me when I told him no, I cannot legally sell him the rifle.

"I said I'd take it so please consider it sold as far as showing it to other people. Easy way to confirm I can buy it In person is just call your local pd and ask them. My ffl says Since neither of us are ffl it's a private sale and the fact that we live in different states is irrelevant."

[Oh Shoot]

[quote name='Left2Die762' timestamp='1352313607' post='841170']
....

"I said I'd take it so please consider it sold as far as showing it to other people. Easy way to confirm I can buy it In person is just call your local pd and ask them. My ffl says Since neither of us are ffl it's a private sale and the fact that we live in different states is irrelevant."
[/quote]

Give him the number of the BATF in the city closest to you or him:

TN: http://www.atf.gov/field/nashville/fo-tennessee.html
MO: http://www.atf.gov/field/kansascity/fo-missouri.html

My Knoxville office has been very responsive on the question or two I've had, agent called me back within 2 hours both times.

- OS

[DaveTN]

[quote name='Left2Die762' timestamp='1352313607' post='841170']
This is what the guy just sent me when I told him no, I cannot legally sell him the rifle.

"I said I'd take it so please consider it sold as far as showing it to other people. Easy way to confirm I can buy it In person is just call your local pd and ask them. My ffl says Since neither of us are ffl it's a private sale and the fact that we live in different states is irrelevant."
[/quote]
He's clueless.

Selling a gun to a convicted felon could be the least of your worries; and pretty hard to prove you knew.

The biggest concern I would have would be that after he told you he was from out of state and you sold to him; he took the cuffs and placed you under arrest.

[Symbolic]

I just called my local office but the phone rang and rang and rang. No one answered. I also didn't know if I needed Group 1 or Group 3 so I called both.

[Symbolic]

Ok. Now I am confused. I called the St. Louis ATF office and spoke to someone there and this is a brief summary of what they said:

It is legal for me to sell him the firearm if he comes to TN. However, the fact that he does not want to go through an FFL is suspcisous and a good reason not to sell anything to him.

I had decided not to sell to him after my posts here, but I really wanted confirmation on what the law was and I'm still not sure lol. Better safe than sorry.

[Oh Shoot]

[quote name='Left2Die762' timestamp='1352314194' post='841185']
I just called my local office but the phone rang and rang and rang. No one answered. I also didn't know if I needed Group 1 or Group 3 so I called both.
[/quote]

Don't worry about it. Let him do the calling.

Just make it clear you'll only do it through an FFL, and it will cost extra of course (generally $20 to 40 depending on which FFL). Also, most FFLs will probably do an interstate transfer between individuals, but some may not -- they are not required to.

Sounds like that will be enough to dissuade him.

- OS

[Oh Shoot]

[quote name='Left2Die762' timestamp='1352314522' post='841192']
Ok. Now I am confused. I called the St. Louis ATF office and spoke to someone there and this is a brief summary of what they said:

It is legal for me to sell him the firearm if he comes to TN. However, the fact that he does not want to go through an FFL is suspcisous and a good reason not to sell anything to him.

I had decided not to sell to him after my posts here, but I really wanted confirmation on what the law was and I'm still not sure lol. Better safe than sorry.
[/quote]

Sounds like they told you exactly correctly, assuming they meant you do it though TN FFL. If they told you that a FFL was unnecessary, you got bad info from some (non)functionary there.

- OS Edited November 7, 2012 by OhShoot

[Symbolic]

I think I talked to a secretary, honestly. I don't think she understood what I was talking about, but she could tell I had a bad gut feeling about this thing and told me to go with it, that the situation just didn't seem right.

[Oh Shoot]

[quote name='Left2Die762' timestamp='1352315091' post='841199']
I think I talked to a secretary, honestly. I don't think she understood what I was talking about, but she could tell I had a bad gut feeling about this thing and told me to go with it, that the situation just didn't seem right.
[/quote]

That part sounds solid enough. If you're far west TN area, maybe he's not that far away, though. Then again, a 400 mile trip, unless it's a quite rare and valuable gun, increases chances of nefarious intent. On the third hand, if he's willing to have 4473 run, it ain't on you, and that's the only way you can legally sell it to him anyway. Your call.

- OS Edited November 7, 2012 by OhShoot

[Symbolic]

After all this, I will only sell to TN residents. I don't care if the gun sells or not, so I'm not out of anything. The whole thing stank. He was willing to drive from St. Louis and spend $100+ in gas instead of paying $30 s&h + $50? transfer fee.

[Hershmeister]

Smart to be suspicious.


Please note that c&r holders may buy guns from other states because they are an FFL for approved weapons. So don't throw the baby out with the bath water.

[herr.baer]

Better safe than sorry in my book.

[FIRERESCUEO2]

I've had this same thing happen more than a few times with out of staters. Some want it shipped, others are willing to drive hundreds of miles. My answer is always the same - FFL or no sale. That usually filters out the bad apples who "insist" that it's perfectly legal. I'm not playing that game....... If its a legit buyer they should have zero issues with a legal transfer. If they insist that they don't want the "paper trail" then I tell them to shop at home - End of story.