What do I need to know about AR-15's

[analog_kidd]

I'm facinated by these guns and would love to have one in my collection. There is a lot I don't understand about them though. I somehow seemed to deduce that you can't just go and buy a new one, you have to build it? Is that true?

Also, it looks like there are tons of parts on the Internet for them and it seems confusing. There are uppers, lowers, stripped lowers, springs, thingamabobs, doo-hickeys, etc. Some can be bought directly, some have to be FFL.

It also seems that you can spend about as much on one as your bank account can feed it. What would be a good starting price for a very basic model that could be added on to later?

Can somebody make it simple for me?

[Rightwinger]

The AR 15 is only another semi automatic rifle just like your Browning or Remington semi auto ONLY its styled on the military rifle, the M16. It does allow the user to have more shots available than most deer rifles should they choose and are allowed to use in their state, the larger capacity magzines.

You can buy them complete or by the piece and assemble in the variation you wish from dealers or shops across the country. The only portion that is controlled and must be purchased through a FFL holder is the lower receiver, the small section where the trigger group is housed and that has the serial number on it. All other parts can be shipped to your door step.

Go to a reputable dealer in your area and take a look. (If you can make it to him, go see Joe at Hero Gear or any of the other recommended shops from the folks in this forum) If you decide to buy one online and have it shipped to your FFL, look at Rock River Arms, DPMS, Sabre, etc. (stay away from Olympic Arms)

Keep reading the posts on ARs here and I would recommend a run over to AR15.com (arfcom) and if you can filter through some of the flame wars, there is tons of info over there.

Once you have your first complete rifle, you can change it up by buying some other caliber upper receivers to change what you shoot! You can shoot things as small as 17 Tactical up to the 458 SOCOM. Then you can look at AR 10 platform for .308 and other larger calibers to add to your collection.

Warning: Black Rifle Disease is completely addictive and can cause irritation to significant others in your family!

[strickj]

analog; I have the same questions about these things.I want one pretty durn bad right now but I am as confused as a straight guy in San Francisco

Do I buy one,build one,get a new or used,A2 or A3,flat top,heck I dont even know what the diff is in an A2,and A3 or a flat top

[wareagle]

Start here:

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=118&t=306487

[Guest price g]

Pointy end down range

[strickj]

Whats the difference in an AR-15 and a M-4

[wareagle]

http://groups.msn.com/TheMarylandAR15ShootersSite/whatisana1a2a3ora4.msnw

What is an A1, A2, A3, A4?

This section deals with the differences in both Receivers and Rifles based on the letter/number combinations.

A1/C7

This is a Bushmaster A1 type upper. It has a tear drop shaped forward assist, and a rear sight that only adjusts for windage (the aperture has two holes the same size one for long distance @375M, the other for a 250M battle sight zero). To adjust the rear sight you either need a rear sight tool, or use a cartridge to press the locking detent. On a 20" barrel each click of windage is 1" at 100 yards. This photo is really of a Canadian C7 type upper (improved A1) it differes from a standard A1 by adding the brass deflector just aft of the forward assist. Early M16s & SP1s used a similar upper (sans brass deflector & forward assist).

A1 type front sights are round and have 5 clicks per rotation (for a 1" change per click at 100 yards when used on a 20" barrel). You don't see these anymore - current rifles produced with A1 type uppers often use A2 type front sights.

A2

This is probably the most common upper seen today. It is used by the M16A2 (and M16A3) and the early version of the M4 carbine. It was the first to have the built in brass deflector. It also sports a round forward assist, and a rear sight that is adjustable for windage and elevation. The elevation wheel is calibrated for M855 shooting out of a 20" barrel out to 800M. On a 20" barrel each click of windage is 0.5" at 100 yards, each click of elevation is 1" at 100 yards. There is a large aperture for low light/close in (< 200M) shooting and a small aperture used for longer range shooting (300m+).

A2 type front sights are square and have 4 clicks per rotation (for a 1.25" change per click at 100 yards when used on a 20" barrel).

A3/A4

- removable carry handle

Also known as the 'flattop'. This is referred to as an A3 type upper by most civilian AR-15 manufactures, and an A4 type by a few. This upper has the same brass deflector and round forward assist of the A2 type upper, but sports a rail to mount optics instead of a rear sight. There is a detachable version of the A2 handle that can be mounted on the rail; its difference is its only calibrated to 600M and the elevation adjustments at 0.5" per click at 100yards. This rail makes it easy to attach a wide variety of optics and night vision so they are at the proper height for a good cheek weld, and they can be removed and reattached with no loss of zero.

Rifle Types:

XM16: Original, non lined barrel, no forward assist. Sights are the windage adjustable only type for the rear, round type front sight. Triangular handguards. Buttstock is 9 7/8" long, has no trapdoor, and the rear sling swivel actually swivels fore and aft. Barrel is light weight (.600" for the whole length) 20" long with an open 3 pronged flash supressor, and 1:12 twist. Selector is safe-semi-auto. Bolt and bolt carrier are chrome plated.

XM16E1: Like the XM16 except forward assist is added to insure bolt closure upon loading.

M16 and M16A1: Essentially the XM16 and XM16E1 with a few mods were officially adopted as the M16 and M16A1. Like above with: Chrome chamber (only, later chrome bore), flash suppressor is changed to the 'bird cage' style to prevent snagging on foliage, bolt carrier is now phosphate covered and chrome lined for reliability. A trap door is added to the stock (to store the cleaning kit), and the rear sling swivel is now fixed in position. Retains the triangular handguards, and XM16 type front & rear sights. A partial magazine fence (raised area) is added to protect the magazine release button on the lower receiver. Selector remains safe-semi-auto.

LTC Santose noted his units M16E1s were updated to partial M16A1 spec (replaced bolt carriers & flash suppressors) in the fall of 1968 in the field (Vietnam). M16 was USAF issue only. XM rifles going thru depot rebuild received all M mods.

M16A2: Barrel is made heavier forward of the front sight (from .60" to .73" diameter), twist is tightened to 1:7 to handle M855 & M856. Upper is changed to the A2 type (with a fully adjustable rear sight & brass deflector), front sight is changed to a square post with courser adjustments. All plastic parts are made from an improved & strenghthened plastic. Stock is lengthened to 10.5" and the buttplate is checkered to hold it in place better. Pistol grip is thickened and a finger groove is added. Handguards are now changed to the round type (stronger & interchangable). Flash suppressor has the holes on the 6 o'clock position filled in so it also acts like a compensator (and stops kicking up dust when firing from the prone). There are re-enforcements to the lower receiver around the receiver extension and the forward take down pin. Selector is safe-semi-burst (shoots only 3 rounds per press of the trigger).

M16A3: Identical to the M16A2 except selector is safe-semi-auto.

M16A4: Flattop version of the M16A2 (no rear sight - it has the optics rail).

XM177/XM177E1: Submachine gun version of the XM16 (no forward assist USAF GAU-5), or XM16E1 (USA). Round handguards, no bayonet lug, 10" barrel, 4" flash/noise supressor, and a ruber covered aluminum 2 position telescoping stock. Very limited production for special operations forces.

XM177E2: Improved XM177E1 submachine gun.. Has an 11.5" barrel (to mount theXM203 grenade launcher) with the same flash/noise supressor as the XM177E1). Otherwise identical to the XM177E1. Retained the rubber covered aluminum telescopting stock. These were originally issued with what proved to be highly unreliable 30 round magazines (different design than current magazine). There were less than 600 of these submachine guns produced and all were made in 1968. These remained experimental submachine guns and were never adopted, hence the XM model numbers. These were also pieced and parted together at unit level in almost infinite varieties. They retained all XM16 internal parts including the chrome bolt carrier group. The Air Force also used this carbine without the forward assist, its nomenclature was GAU-5/A/A.

M4: Early version sported an A2 carry handle, later ones had the flattop receiver. Selector is safe-semi-burst, it sports a 14.5" barrel with an A2 type flash suppressor. Barrel is skinny under the handguards and thickens to .73" from the muzzle to the front sight, there is a cut in the barrel forward of the front sight to facilitate adding a M203 grenade launcher. The stock is of the fiberlite telescoping kind (which has recently been improved). There are also fatter oval profile handguards with double heat shields.

M4A1: Just like the M4, except they are all flattop receivers. Selector is safe-semi-auto. Newer versions have a slightly heavier barrel (thicker under the handguards) to handle full-auto fire for longer periods.

[Guest jaypee]

StrickJ

The M4 is a carbine version of the basic AR 15 rifle, which is a civilian version of the military M-16. The M4 is easily identified by a milled out channel going all the way around the barrel about an inch wide to accomodate a grenade launcher's mounting system, the launcher being located beneath the barrel. The M4 has a collapsible stock for easy of entry/exit from armored vehicles and other tight spots. Even though it carries the military M4 name, it is semiautomatic only.

You can save a lot of money by building your own AR from component assemblies provided by companies like Del-Ton over in North Carolina. They provide a host of kits using DPMS or Wilson barrels, your choice, and Stag Arms parts, which are also first rate. I have built an M4 from their components and kept the price under $700, which is quite a bit less than you would pay in a retail store. But they also sell kits for all sorts of models that encompass the entire AR roundup. Their website is www.Del-Ton.com and they are great people to deal with. Their parts and assemblies are very popular here in East Tennessee.

My friends and I have gotten pretty active in the AR thing, so if I can help answer any questions for you I'll be glad to help. The only piece of advice I will leave you with right now is if you go looking for an AR, there are a small number of really ratty companies making them, so until you get your feet on the ground AR - wise, don't buy one unless it is well known to AR users.

JayPee

[Im Neero]

What do you need to know about them? They're black, evil looking, and scare democrats.

StrickJ, you live in Chattanooga, so I would recommend you make a short drive over to Winchester and see the guys at Hero Gear. They can tell you everything you need to know, and then cut you a deal on a rifle if you decide that you want one.

[Guest Boomhower]

Great. 9 post and I'm already on information overload.....An AR-15 is one of the things on my list, but I have way to much to learn before I jump into one. This is a great start though.

[Rightwinger]

For all of you....the great thing about the AR platform is you don't get stuck into anything! About the only thing you want to decide is do you want the classic AR with the carry handle or a flat top (A3/A4) and put a scope or holo like the EOtech on it. You'll also want to decide on barrel length. Standard (20 inch), Mid length (16 inch) or Carbine (16 inch with the short hand guard) After that, as you get more info and become more familiar with it, add to it! I'm not a RRA shill but I do own a bunch of their parts (in three different rifles). Go here and get the basic model rifle, then mod it up as much or little as you want. Plain Jane to Mall Ninja!

http://www.rockriverarms.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_id=225

http://www.rockriverarms.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_id=224

[strickj]

Can you get them in 3 round burst(pardon i dont know the name),or how does that work?

[BimmerFreak]

Can you get them in 3 round burst(pardon i dont know the name),or how does that work?

The short answer is:

Yes, you can get them in 3 round burst.

How do you get them? Spend around 12-15k on a transferable M16.

Long (and very detailed) answer is here:

http://www.tngunowners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5294

[Rightwinger]

or get a good AR and work on that trigger finger to get really fast 3 times !

[Guest Medic908]

[ame]

[/ame]

[Rightwinger]

uh, yeah.....bump fire. Not recommended. Quality trigger and practice on reaquiring target quickly is the ticket.

[Guest Medic908]

uh, yeah.....bump fire. Not recommended. Quality trigger and practice on reaquiring target quickly is the ticket.

I agree, but it looked fun...

[Guest atomemphis]

i'm in the same boat as the guys that are new to AR's.

I like the quality of the Sun Devil billet lowers and uppers (and the reviews of them on ar15.com) so I'll be ordering a set soon.

QUESTION: Is a Forward Assist a must? They have a seemingly good deal on a Sun Devil upper from Rainier Arms without FA, but I'd hate to spend the wampum to get it, only to replace it shortly down the road.

[Guest EasilyObsessed]

i'm in the same boat as the guys that are new to AR's.

I like the quality of the Sun Devil billet lowers and uppers (and the reviews of them on ar15.com) so I'll be ordering a set soon.

QUESTION: Is a Forward Assist a must? They have a seemingly good deal on a Sun Devil upper from Rainier Arms without FA, but I'd hate to spend the wampum to get it, only to replace it shortly down the road.

Spend the money and get the forward assist. I have used mine many times, specifically on the first round of a fresh magazine when I have tried to slingshot the bolt back instead of dropping it.

[Im Neero]

I've heard that the forward assist isn't really very important. I've never used mine.

[strickj]

Theres something else I know nothing about

Sorry Analog,I think I kinda hijacked you thread:koolaid:

[Guest Killthewabbit]

One that you need to know about AR's...is that once you start buyin' em, you cant stop. It's a condition known as the "evil black rifle disease".

While it's not usually fatal...it is terminal.

[Urse]

They are second place to the AK.

[Guest price g]

One that you need to know about AR's...is that once you start buyin' em, you cant stop. It's a condition known as the "evil black rifle disease".

While it's not usually fatal...it is terminal.

If ever more true words were spoken

[Guest UKTN]

I went to buy an AK 47 but ended up with an AR 15 as my wife didn't want any commie gun in our house. Patriotic to the core