EssOne

Second that motion. She really needs to take this PT preparation thing seriously John455.

That's a big 10-4 there Rubber Ducky. See ya on the backside.

DARN!! Hodor is my favorite character - reminds me of a drill sergeant I had in the army!! :rofl:

I agree, DaveTN. The final judgment will revolve around what the officer reasonably believed at the time he fired the shots, the "reasonably" part being what juries get paid to rule on.

I agree, and again, the crux of the entire thing hasn't been released yet. Additional information not yet made public could really put a different light on all of this, Like I told 300winmag, I'm still hedging my bets a little bit until a hearing is held. Right now it looks mighty bad for the officer, but we don't yet know the whole story.

I agree. That's why I'm hedging my bet a little bit until a hearing is held.  They don't call it the "drive-by media" for nothing.

The best way to see if it's a real cop is to Dial 911 and tell the dispatcher an unmarked car purporting to be a police car is attempting to stop you and you want verification that it's a real cop. The dispatch center will get your license number and location, then contact all units on the air and ask if any of them are trying to stop you. Go from there.

This may or may not be correct, bersaguy. There are differences between a citizen's authority and an officer's authority.  In many states an LEO may use deadly force on a fleeing felon to stop him. In recent years these states have clarified this to mean violent felonies only, and it goes back to the old west days when a felon was always a radically dangerous person you didn't want escaping. But it doesn't end there. You have departmental policies coming to bear on the subject as well.    In my department the law said you could use deadly force on a fleeing felon who had committed a violent felony, period. But our department's shooting policy, (which is binding on all officers in the department with the force of law) clearly stated that the use of deadly force in these circumstances was only authorized when no other means of apprehension was possible or when all possible alternatives had failed. Most departments I worked around added similar limitations on the use of deadly force against fleeing felons above and beyond these legal requirements.   Now, I have no idea if South Carolina has such a statute, and we need to give ourselves a little wiggle room on this count until this all shakes out in coming days. But I would think that if the Chief of Police and Mayor have disavowed the officer's actions, you can bet the City Attorney and/or the District Attorney has reviewed the evidence too and concurs with them. I also suspect that the Governor and State Attorney General have weighed in too.  So I really doubt that any fleeing felon statute is in play. (I don't see a felony on the part of the citizen so far, but like I said, I don't know South Carolina law. So we'll have to wait and see. I'm a little uncomfortable right now because I can't find out specific details on what transpired between the traffic stop and the shooting.)   After a shooting death most states require some sort of hearing by a Coroner's Jury, Grand Jury, or a Preliminary Hearing in Court in these cases and I haven't seen any indication that one has been held yet. When one of these is held, we'll pretty well know what happened.    Barring any unusual legalities or mitigating circumstances that may still come to bear in the officer's favor, everything I know about the case so far says he is probably in worse than serious trouble.   My LE experience was not in Tennessee, just to make that clear.

The CZ 75 and the BHP are two entirely different animals, especially the B series CZ's. For anyone who would like to see an extremely authoritative comparison of the two, BHP authority Steven A. Camp covered it in great detail in his article: "Browning/FN Hi Power and CZ-75: Are They Related? " from his blog HiPowers and Handguns, and can be found here   http://www.hipowersandhandguns.com/Browning%20and%20CZ.htm   FWIW

I bought a Pre-B CZ 85 in 1992 and have since owned a CZ 75 .40,, two CZ 85 B's, and a CZ 83. For me there is no other handgun for defensive purposes because of it's superior ergonomics. I have fired thousand round instsructor courses with them and they functioned flawlessly. You might find this kindle book helpful: http://www.amazon.com/EVOLUTION-CZ-85-Jerry-Paregien-ebook/dp/B00DOPTMF2/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1428427051&sr=1-1&keywords=The+evolution+of+the+CZ+85. It compares the new CZ75B/85B series with the older Pre-B series and gives accuracy testing and other useful information. Its costs a whopping 99 cents and Amazon has a free Kindle download if you don't have a Kindle.

GunSlingers in Kingsport has a few really nice ones. A few carbines too, which I believe were M44's. Didn't look at prices, but I'm pretty sure they'd talk to you about it on the phone.

Agreed, sir, if one has properly addressed the issue of wise/unwise pistol selection. Here's what I mean:  Carrying cocked and locked is fine as long as you can flip the safety off, as you obviously can, without impairing your grip, or causing you to adjust your grip before you can get off a shot. If you have to do this, it mitigates any good that having a big bore pistol may otherwise afford you. Shootability in one's hands is the most important element of pistol selection, and, in the case of cocked and locked carry, that includes the ability to flip off a safety without having to readjust the gun.  I say all of this because there's no way I have ever been able to do it, either on a 1911 or BHP, so it would be extremely unwise for me to even consider these guns for carry purposes. I could train until it freezes in a hot place widely mentioned in the Holy Scriptures, and I still couldn't get off a competent first shot without adjusting the gun in my hand after dropping the safety.

I hope this doesn't muddy the waters, but I was in LE and went through all of this difficult thinkery after I retired. I had carried 1911's off duty for years but was never entirely comfortable with them because of the issues you gents have identified in this thread. Same with the Browning Hi Power I carried off duty for a similar period.  My solution, at least the one that fits me best, was to go with the CZ 75/85 design, which is a SA/DA design with a non-decocking manual safety and a "firing pin safety" or "drop safety." Since all of my LE training was on the DA/SA platform,  the CZ system was a natural, especially given its superior ergonomics. I really agree that I don't want anything to do with dropping a safety before I can fire a gun, so I carry my CZ's hammer- down DA.   The bonus for me is that if my arthritic hands ever get so arthritic that I can't handle the DA part, I can swallow my objections and carry the gun SA with the safety locked, and still have the protection of the drop safety. Also, I use the CZ 85B because of it's ambi safety levers for the same reason. Us DORF's (Dedicated Old Retired Farts)  have to think like this. :usa:   The striker fired guns offer some advantages, but aren't for me. Go for it if you like them, though.

Prices like that really push my jackass button. But I try to be out of the store before ol' jack comes out though. :pleased:

Yes I'm familiar with the FM Detective. Now that they're not available any more a lot of guys realize what a good idea they were and wish they had one. Same with the FEG guns.

Love the lol part hipower - I found this gun literally new in the box here in Tennessee a couple of years ago and its total round count is no more than 200 rounds. it still had the factory grease on it and was still wrapped in the factory plastic sheeting. The slide is off to Novaks for the three dot treatment and I'm fixin' to give the round count a rather notable boost. :usa:   Oh yeah, just so a fellow of your namesake won't be too offended, I really do own a Browning Hi Power too.   EssOne

Just in case anyone is in the market for a pair of Hogue checkered rosewood grips, here are a few photos of how they look fresh out of the box - not photoshopped by the manufacturer. This is what you get. I was extremely pleased with the fit and especially with the sharpness of the checkering. (Look at how nicely the grips follow the line of the safety lever.)These were $57.99 from Amazon.com with free shipping. These particular grips are for the Browning Hi Power and are installed a FEG PJK-9HP without any fitting required. EssOne

You'll love it. Have a ball. My best loads were with IMR 4064 and IMR 4350 FWIW. Remington brass and Federal match primers.

I honestly don't know what your problem is, neighbor, but the chronograph is the weakest link in your chain, so I think my next step would be to go out with some proven loads and fire them over it just like before. If it gives erratic velocities on the known loads, then the chrono is probably your answer. I don't think I'd fire any more of the suspect loads without pulling the bullets and checking the powder charges again, just to be safe. I have a 6.5x55 sporter I built and have loaded for it quite a bit over the years. None of the things you are worried about are problems. You'll love it. My favorite load is a 120 grain Nosler Ballistic Tip at 3,050 fps. Here are a few photos of it. It is a Mark X Whitworth Mauser action with a 24" medium weight Shilen barrel in a nice piece of Northern California English Walnut. [URL=http://s275.photobucket.com/user/jaypee3843/media/PICT0056_zpsa3c7736f.jpg.html][/URL] [URL=http://s275.photobucket.com/user/jaypee3843/media/PICT0053_zps7dec7568.jpg.html][/URL] [URL=http://s275.photobucket.com/user/jaypee3843/media/PICT0060_zpsa82dde0d.jpg.html][/URL] [URL=http://s275.photobucket.com/user/jaypee3843/media/PICT0061_zps900fc345.jpg.html][/URL]

Man I love your photography. Beautiful pics.

robtatoo, I'd do two things before shooting any more of those cartridges.     First, run a check of your scale to make sure it's giving correct weights. Weighing a new bullet of a known weight will give you a good idea if it's off or not, or you can borrow a buddy's scale to verify yours with.   Second, go to your powder cabinet and make darn sure you loaded the powder you think you loaded. A good friend of mine blew up a beautiful custom '98 Mauser by grabbing Olin 296 pistol powder instead of Olin 760, which had similar markings. They were side by side on the shelf and he didn't know what he'd done wrong until we broke down one of the crumpled rounds in the magazine and compared the powder granules in it with the two powders. There was no doubt about it - he put 55 grains of pistol powder in the case and blew the rifle to kingdom come. FWIW, I always used two scales to hand measure loads, one to constantly verify the other, and I ran "bullet checks" like I described fairly often too. With a high pressure round like the .308 or.270 I pour myself an extra measure of  careful . Hope this helps.

Thank you for such kind words, sir. Best wishes to you as well.

Hmmm. Apparently hunger isn't the motivator it used to be, huh John? :pleased:

I wouldn't either if I didn't live darn near within sight of a chemical plant and an army ammunition plant.

I mention evacuation only from the standpoint of the portability of this food supply, not whether or not it's advisable. The point is that if you are forced to boogie, this supply is transportable and edible without cooking. Nothing more.   As for the advisability of leaving, I agree that unless I'm in the kill zone of an impending nuke or chemical/biological weapons attack, I'll stay home too. But having survived the entirety of the Cold War, I believe those things to be entirely possible any more, so I'm going to plan as if I believe so. I have destinations where friends can put us up in all four directions from here. The least I can do is show up with some food.