Bigger loads save more?

[Ramjo]

I have been doing some research on reloading and found somewhere that you do not necessarily save as much reloading 9mm as you would a .357 or a 45 acp round. Anybody figured out if this is true?

I am wanting to get into reloading and the two calibers I happen to use the most are the 357 and 45.

[Guest UberDuper]

Reloading 9mm doesn't have much of a cost benefit if you're just plinking. Not nearly the benefit of reloading 45 or .357.

[Jonnin]

Well I can call the concept flawed a bit, as one of the biggest savings I know of is .380 which is a smallish caliber -- cut down from $15-20 per box to about $3.

You do not save as much on 9mm because 9mm is produced in bulk for military purposes across the planet. Most of the cheap 9mm is steel cased or something, which is hard on guns and magazines that were not made for it, or basically inferior ammo in some way. Reloads that cost the same as the rock bottom cheap 9mm are more consistent and better quality all around for the same price, or, you are saving money vs higher priced 9mm ammo, whichever way you look at it, but it is still not as good a savings as most other calibers because 9mm is a cheap to buy caliber -- at the most you save less than 1-3 bucks on a box of 50. In that respect, 9mm is an anomaly because it is so cheap, and 380 is an anomaly because it is so costly.

In general, then, yes the bigger the round the better the savings, with rifle rounds costing a fraction of the ~buck a round factory ammo prices. 45 is a huge savings, from $20 a box to far less than 1/2 that. 357 is also going to be a huge savings esp if you make light target loads, using less powder or lighter bullets etc, for a revolver --- you can basically reload to 38 special specs in a 357 case, or even load 38s to save even more money. For an auto 357 you have to make it able to cycle the action: I see this on my 44 mags, my revolvers are fun with 15 grains of powder while my auto takes 17.5 to cycle the action, for example, whcih adds a cent or so to each shot.

To make a long story short, you have 2 perfect calibers for saving some money by reloading =)

[Caster]

ohh yeah? Well, I can assure you that is totally dependent on the person and their resources/resourcefulness. Let's look at my current load.

*I pick my brass up from the range = $0

*Lee truncated cone 124g bullet, actually falls 130g; The lead for which I don't pay for [perks of the job] BUT if you shop around a bucket of wheel weights can still be had reasonably cheap. [just not from me:)]

*My load runs 5g of AA #5; 8lb jug of #5 runs $135 - (7,000x8) ÷ 5 = 11,200 Figure spillage and margin of error in metering and it's safe to call it 10,000 per 8lbs - $135 ÷ 10,000 = .013 or round up to two cents each.

*Standard small pistol primer runs $35 per 1,000 or .035, call it 4 cents each.

I tumble lube and even though a bottle will do way more than a thousand bullets, let's say I'm sloppy and wasteful. $5 per bottle.

I load 9x19 for 6 cents each [plus lube] or $65 per thousand.

Now, if you figure buying a bucket of wheel weights and the electricity to smelt [do that at work, so I don't pay that either], melt and cast you still ought to be able to get in there for ten cents each.

Mold, melting pot, ladle and what not are nonperishable tooling given reasonable care and as such are not calculated into the cost.

Now, before you pass judgement consider this; This isn't just a load CCI or Winchester cranks out with the educated guess they will run well in my particular pistol, this load was worked up from start, sized appropriate to MY BORE, and they cycle perfectly.....not to mention they will tear one ragged hole 10 paces all day.

9mm not cost effective to reload? Well, maybe not for everyone.

[Ramjo]

Ok cool. I have been looking at the Dillon presses and I am more interested in a progressive press. One problem I have already noticed that I may have is that the brass I am saving for the 45 acp, uses both the small and large primers. Federal uses small and winchester uses the bigger. Should I just start saving one type to make life easier?

[deerslayer]

9mm is a cheap to buy caliber -- at the most you save less than 1-3 bucks on a box of 50.

I totally disagree. My 115 FMJs with store-bought components breaks down like so:

4.6 grains of Titegroup .01

Winchester primer .03

Precision Delta 115 FMJ .07

brass case .00 (usually)

$0.11/round = $5.50/box of 50.

I think I'm saving more than $1, and my stuff is better than UMC, WWB, or Federal.

Ramjo, set aside the small primer .45 brass unless you have a MASSIVE supply of it.

Edited June 11, 2011 by deerslayer

[gregintenn]

You don't reload to save money....you reload to shoot more. You can't expect significant savings on everyday calibers. You do get more versatility, and you don't have to wait for Wal Mart to "get in another shipment". Where the cost savings comes in is with oddball cartridges. 30 Carbine, 218 Bee, 7.7 Jap, 8mm Mauser, 7x57, 41 Magnum, 401 Herter's Powermag, 41 Colt just to name a few.

[SpacemanSpiff]

Last I calculated 9mm, my reloading cost for materials per 50 rounds was around $6. When I started reloading in 2008, there was not much savings since you could buy a box of 50 for about $7. At today's prices for 9mm, I'm saving more per round.

The other day at the range, I shot 200 rounds of .40 S&W. Normally, it may have been 100. I agree that you reload to shoot more, not necessarily to save. Roughly, I can shoot twice as many reloaded rounds for the same money as store bought.

[Ramjo]

Last I calculated 9mm, my reloading cost for materials per 50 rounds was around $6. When I started reloading in 2008, there was not much savings since you could buy a box of 50 for about $7. At today's prices for 9mm, I'm saving more per round.

The other day at the range, I shot 200 rounds of .40 S&W. Normally, it may have been 100. I agree that you reload to shoot more, not necessarily to save. Roughly, I can shoot twice as many reloaded rounds for the same money as store bought.

Exactly. I know I wont save money in the long run because I will end up shooting more. It's just right now I dont like having to conserve ammo so much.

[dlm37015]

577 nintro cost about 65.00 per round if i have the brass and use a cast bullet it cost about 40 cents thats a no brainer

sometimes you can find cheap cheap ammo for less than reloading your own but why would you put that crap in your gun when you can load much better ammo for less money than you can buy if you are going to compare handloads with cheap store bought ammo dont compare good brass cased ammo with steel cased crap or something else

[Jonnin]

I totally disagree. My 115 FMJs with store-bought components breaks down like so:

4.6 grains of Titegroup .01

Winchester primer .03

Precision Delta 115 FMJ .07

brass case .00 (usually)

$0.11/round = $5.50/box of 50.

I think I'm saving more than $1, and my stuff is better than UMC, WWB, or Federal.

Ramjo, set aside the small primer .45 brass unless you have a MASSIVE supply of it.

5.50 + $3 is 8.50. The ad at the top of this page (off and on as they are random, but you will see it today if you look) says a box of 50 for $8.95 or something.... and I have seen bulk steel cased junk 9mm for as low as $8 a box (7.99, whatever) as of this year.

Now, if you get everything for free like caster does, sure its a huge savings, you can't argue with THAT. Well done!

If you buy the slugs, its hard to save more than $1-3 a box, as I said. Compare to buying the materials for a 45 or 380, which are harder to find range-brass for free (45 is tolerable, but a lot of the cases are sorry quality). Doing the exact same thing, the savings are much, much greater for other calibers than 9. If you make the slugs and pick up the cases, all ammo for any caliber is basically free, of course, though some rifle loads eat up more than a few cents of powder.

[Jonnin]

Ok cool. I have been looking at the Dillon presses and I am more interested in a progressive press. One problem I have already noticed that I may have is that the brass I am saving for the 45 acp, uses both the small and large primers. Federal uses small and winchester uses the bigger. Should I just start saving one type to make life easier?

Oh, and not all federal is small primer. Some is, some is not. Blazer is often small primer, and I have not seen any of it that was large (but it may exist?). The federal large primer cases that are brass (not nickel or silver plated whatever) reload very well for me, I like them. I just throw away (well, into the recycle brass bucket) the small primer brass but I only get 1/100 or so of them.

[1gewehr]

If you buy the slugs, its hard to save more than $1-3 a box, as I said.

No matter how you look at it, $3/box means you get to shoot 50% more ammo. I buy components in bulk when they show up on sale. I'd say my cost for reloading 9mm is closer to $5/box with bought bullets, powder, primers, and including new polishing media and compound every 5000rds. Buying 1 pound of powder, a single box of primers, and a couple of hundred bullets at a time is expensive. You really get to save when you buy powder in 8lb jugs, 5000 primers to the case, and 2000bullets in a case.

You are correct that the savings get better with larger calibers! Mostly because the brass you are re-using is a proportionally larger expense of the factory ammo. Most rifle ammo gives really great savings.

[Jonnin]

exactly!

I do reload 9, because its better quality for lower cost (even if not much lower). But if economics were the only reason, IE if the cheap 9mm were great quality, I would just buy it. The time spent for the money saved in 9mm isnt worth it and I would be better off, if money were the only issue, to reload the other stuff and buy the 9.

[gregintenn]

The truth is that if you get into reloading simply to save money, you will be disappointed. It is a fringe benefit of reloading, but if you count your time, the savings are pretty much neglible for most people. It is akin to taking up farming in order to save money on groceries.

[Caster]

Well put Greg.

Also, I think a good percentage of people who get into reloading find what an awesome hobby it is. Some days I like to reload more than actually shooting. Up until recently when I did a major consolidation/purge of my inventory I have even been known to load for calibers I don't even own. I loaded every piece of 30/30 I found for years, anticipating me purchasing one. I had close to 500 rounds of it in an ammo can waiting. Ended up giving it to a close friend who was (very much so!) thankful. Reloading is as addictive as anything I have ever seen.

[East_TN_Patriot]

You don't reload to save money....you reload to shoot more.

I think this argument is one in the same. A person who reloads will get more ammo to shoot for the same amount of money. That's saving money in my book and I reload to save money. Seems like you're splitting hairs.

Edited June 13, 2011 by East_TN_Patriot

[gregintenn]

A person who reloads will get more ammo to shoot for the same amount of money.

Exactly. This isn't "saving money". You said "the same amount of money". It equates to shooting more. I'm nearly certain I spend more on reloading components than I would spend on ammo if I didn't. I also own guns I wouldn't own if I didn't reload. Saving money isn't in the picture.

Theoretically, one could save money on seafood by catching his own fish. I don't know if you are a fisherman, but I expect I've spent more than $1000 per pound on the fish I've caught myself and eaten.

If I wanted to save money, I wouldn't shoot or fish.

Edited June 13, 2011 by gregintenn

[JAB]

I haven't gotten started reloading, yet, but I wonder if 'saving money' depends on the individual. For instance, I am looking at reloading (at least at first) only for .38/.357 and .44. I don't like ordering ammo online and usually don't have a couple of hundred bucks to drop on a single ammo order so that I can realize the real savings, anyhow. In my case, then, it doesn't really matter what price or ammo is available on bulk orders from Midway, etc. this week. The only prices that matter to me are the prices at my LGS, Walmart and maybe some of the 'big box' sporting goods stores. Walmart's price of sixteen bucks a box (actually, probably a few cents more but we'll call it sixteen) for UMC FMJ .38 Special is just about the best price I have seen 'on shelves', lately (when they aren't out of stock on .38 Special ammo.) I hope it won't cost that much to roll my own. The least expensive .44 I have seen is also at Walmart - WWB .44 Magnum at a bit over $32 per box (plus tax.) Thing is, I'm not planning to plink with full-on .44 Mag and find .44 Specials to be a lot of fun for shooting paper. Walmart doesn't stock .44 Specials and I don't recall seeing them anywhere else all that often. When I do find them, they cost anywhere from nearly as much as .44 Mag to possibly even more than .44 Mag.

I honestly don't think I could shoot much more than I already do. I just don't think I could find the time or opportunity. For me, then, reloading will be about saving money per round fired as well as actually being able to build and keep an onhand supply of more than two or three boxes of each for those calibers.

[Jonnin]

I haven't gotten started reloading, yet, but I wonder if 'saving money' depends on the individual. For instance, I am looking at reloading (at least at first) only for .38/.357 and .44. I don't like ordering ammo online and usually don't have a couple of hundred bucks to drop on a single ammo order so that I can realize the real savings, anyhow. In my case, then, it doesn't really matter what price or ammo is available on bulk orders from Midway, etc. this week. The only prices that matter to me are the prices at my LGS, Walmart and maybe some of the 'big box' sporting goods stores. Walmart's price of sixteen bucks a box (actually, probably a few cents more but we'll call it sixteen) for UMC FMJ .38 Special is just about the best price I have seen 'on shelves', lately (when they aren't out of stock on .38 Special ammo.) I hope it won't cost that much to roll my own. The least expensive .44 I have seen is also at Walmart - WWB .44 Magnum at a bit over $32 per box (plus tax.) Thing is, I'm not planning to plink with full-on .44 Mag and find .44 Specials to be a lot of fun for shooting paper. Walmart doesn't stock .44 Specials and I don't recall seeing them anywhere else all that often. When I do find them, they cost anywhere from nearly as much as .44 Mag to possibly even more than .44 Mag.

I honestly don't think I could shoot much more than I already do. I just don't think I could find the time or opportunity. For me, then, reloading will be about saving money per round fired as well as actually being able to build and keep an onhand supply of more than two or three boxes of each for those calibers.

44 is one of the biggest savers, $7-9 for a box of 50 depending on what you are making. I havent messed with 357 but it is going to be about the same as 9mm for components, just double or so the powder cost, and much cheaper than factory ammo.