Question for Kel-Tec owners

[Tobashadow]

Warning - I tend to draw out my question's sometimes, sorry.

I've been looking at the P3at model and plan on getting a smaller carry gun about middle of next month and before other's chime in that the ruger lcp is out, i'm on my second fullsize ruger and if it wasn't that it was fine i'd sell it off since my experince with a ruger's warrenty suck's, and i really don't like a company that pulls the copy then take credit for it deal either.

Ive heard over and over everywhere on the net that the kel-tec warrenty is almost second to none, but that they seem to sometimes have quality problems but it seems the factory will take care of it if needed no problems.

The question i have is safety?

For instance my ruger p95 and my bersa thunder 380 have a decock lever and a safety so i feel safe with one in the chamber for it since it's just click and fire.

Where as my 22 pistol has a somewhat safety which is actually almost impossiable to turn off with one hand becuase of it's postion and makes it utterly useless to use since it would be faster to try to pistol whip the guy with it then try to click off the safety, so i'm a bit touchy with it as far as keeping one in the chamber. In a matter of words i don't. but don't get me wrong i love the gun i just don't feel it's safe with one in the hole.

Where in lies my question.

I see no safety on the kel-tec at all and i was thinking going down the road recently and thought what if my wife was driving and someone came to her window and for example pulled a knife or gun out on her (typical car jacking). First instinct would for me to use my left hand to hold her back out of the line of fire and put my hand between her and the soon to be gunshot victim to act as a makeshift shield. But that would mean i only have one hand to operate the gun so that puts out pulling the slide.

The problem is ive been able to hold one but not shoot one. And the only place for me to shoot one before buying is a long long drive from here and the last two times they didn't have one to try out for one reason or the other. And the local shop with no range beats the other place in price even before counting the extra for gas and he even throws in a second clip in on it. Buying it without shooting it first is no big deal to me since i understand it wont be a plinker anyways. It will have a job to do and thats it so harsh shooting style would be no concern to me if the SHTF anyways.

Could someone explain more in detail the safety and usage of it's double action trigger in your experince please

Thanks

I just hate to buy one and not feel safe to have one in the chamber on it and always be back in the hunt for another pocket buddy.

Edited April 9, 2008 by Tobashadow

[Guest bkelm18]

The P3AT has no external safety. I can't remember if it has a firing pin safety or not. It has a very long DAO trigger pull which is good enough for me. I carry mine all the time. Get a pocket holster and carry with one in the chamber. That's really the only way to carry a gun. I feel absolutely safe with it.

[Marswolf]

The P3AT has no manual safety. The DAO trigger and trigger throw mean it ain't going off unless you definitely pull the trigger. No realistic concern that something will just hit the trigger and accidentally set it off, as in some guns.

There is no firing pin block, which is, as I understand it, the reason it isn't sold in Kalifornia. But the P3AT has a real, if hidden, hammer and a stiff firing pin spring. Again, there is no realistic way it is going off by dropping it.

I'm probably going to get yet another P3AT to use as a car gun. It will be easy to hide and always ready to fire. I've had a couple so far and really like them.

I carry all of my handguns with one in the chamber and the safety off. I won't carry any handgun that I think is unsafe with the safety off and one in the chamber.

[Guest Boonie]

Warning - I tend to draw out my question's sometimes, sorry.

I've been looking at the P3at model and plan on getting a smaller carry gun about middle of next month and before other's chime in that the ruger lcp is out, i'm on my second fullsize ruger and if it wasn't that it was fine i'd sell it off since my experince with a ruger's warrenty suck's, and i really don't like a company that pulls the copy then take credit for it deal either.

Ive heard over and over everywhere on the net that the kel-tec warrenty is almost second to none, but that they seem to sometimes have quality problems but it seems the factory will take care of it if needed no problems.

The question i have is safety?

For instance my ruger p95 and my bersa thunder 380 have a decock lever and a safety so i feel safe with one in the chamber for it since it's just click and fire.

Where as my 22 pistol has a somewhat safety which is actually almost impossiable to turn off with one hand becuase of it's postion and makes it utterly useless to use since it would be faster to try to pistol whip the guy with it then try to click off the safety, so i'm a bit touchy with it as far as keeping one in the chamber. In a matter of words i don't. but don't get me wrong i love the gun i just don't feel it's safe with one in the hole.

Where in lies my question.

I see no safety on the kel-tec at all and i was thinking going down the road recently and thought what if my wife was driving and someone came to her window and for example pulled a knife or gun out on her (typical car jacking). First instinct would for me to use my left hand to hold her back out of the line of fire and put my hand between her and the soon to be gunshot victim to act as a makeshift shield. But that would mean i only have one hand to operate the gun so that puts out pulling the slide.

The problem is ive been able to hold one but not shoot one. And the only place for me to shoot one before buying is a long long drive from here and the last two times they didn't have one to try out for one reason or the other. And the local shop with no range beats the other place in price even before counting the extra for gas and he even throws in a second clip in on it. Buying it without shooting it first is no big deal to me since i understand it wont be a plinker anyways. It will have a job to do and thats it so harsh shooting style would be no concern to me if the SHTF anyways.

Could someone explain more in detail the safety and usage of it's double action trigger in your experince please

Thanks

I just hate to buy one and not feel safe to have one in the chamber on it and always be back in the hunt for another pocket buddy.

i have a kal-tec P-3at and i was wondering the same thing but the owners manual says the hammer will not fall untill the triger is pulled all the way back. but i like the decocker on my ruger p-89. the P-3at gun shoots great the only thing i dont like about mine is it hurts my ring finger when it kicks so i have ordered some grip extenders and i will try them out when i get them. also note the shell when it ejects out mine goes almost straight up and falls down after i shoot it it is kind of neat when you shoot it and a second later the shell fall down:) but dont get me wrong i like the gun because it is so small and easy to shoot and i got tired of wating on a lcp .380 to be in stock.

[mousegunner]

Marswolf is right. The p3at trigger takes a long deliberate pull. The gun won't go off accidentally, or with a light tug on the trigger, as with a GLOCK. The caution about keeping everything else out of your pocket with your p3at is also wise.

[Smith]

It has the same safety as a revolver. Neither has gone off on their own without a deliberate trigger pull, that I am aware of.

[Tobashadow]

Thanks guys that explains ALOT.

Anyone got the belt clip for it? and how far does it stick out past the back of the clip like for say in your pocket or iwb using the clip, pics are helpful too if you have time.

Any recommended owb belt holsters for it that in perticular ride high so that it stays under a basic t-shirt pulled over it.

Oh and i aint a rich man so a less then $30 holster is recomended. :-)

I just want something comfy since it probably will not be a front pocket buddy unless it's rare since i keep alot of my normal day to day things in my right front pocket because of a left hand problem. Unless it's in the back pocket which is the reason for the question on the belt clip if needed in that position.

[-boatman-]

Tobashadow, Your ruger with the decocker completely cocks the hammer when the slide moves back. The Keltec only moves the hammer back half way and pulling the trigger pulls it the rest of the way back so it needs no decocker. The long trigger pull is just like a revolver in D/A. It needs no safety and is completely safe. If you get a chance to shoot one you'll see.

[strickj]

Yes,what they said.It has a looong,heavy trigger pull.I let someone fire mine at the nooga shoot couple weeks ago and afterwords he said,man I didn't think it was ever gonna fire.

Completely safe to carry with one in the pipe

[GLOCKMEISTER]

just think of it like carrying a revolver... btw I sold my keltec since I got me LCP. Just an fyi.

[Marswolf]

just think of it like carrying a revolver... btw I sold my keltec since I got me LCP. Just an fyi.

We'd figured that out.

I kept mine. Plan to get another.

[Guest bigbuck_tn]

Technically anything that does not either have a firing pin block, (Like a Glock by the way, or a PPK w/the safety on), a cam surface that moves the firing pin out line with the hole in the breech face, will fire if struck hard enough on the front of the gun.

Examples are 1911's w/o series 80 lockwork (Which includes basically all 1911's except Colt and Para since Colt owns the patent), PPK's w/o the safety on, all revolvers with frame mounted firing pins. If there is nothing between the firing pin and the primer a hard enough strike to the front of the gun will cause the round to go off. The gun with the cartridge moving backward will hit the firing pin which has it's own inertia and will resist moving backwards. Then BOOM!!

Anything that does not have either a transfer bar lockwork or a hammer block safety will also fire if the gun is hit hard enough on the rear of the gun. Examples are (again) the 1911, ALL Colt Single Action Army's except the Cowboy, old style S&W Revolvers w/ hammer mounted firing pins.

Very few firearms are truly "drop safe" although handguns are by far the safest of all firearms. Don't drop your shotgun!!!!

[Guest bkelm18]

Technically anything that does not either have a firing pin block, (Like a Glock by the way, or a PPK w/the safety on), a cam surface that moves the firing pin out line with the hole in the breech face, will fire if struck hard enough on the front of the gun.

Examples are 1911's w/o series 80 lockwork (Which includes basically all 1911's except Colt and Para since Colt owns the patent), PPK's w/o the safety on, all revolvers with frame mounted firing pins. If there is nothing between the firing pin and the primer a hard enough strike to the front of the gun will cause the round to go off. The gun with the cartridge moving backward will hit the firing pin which has it's own inertia and will resist moving backwards. Then BOOM!!

Anything that does not have either a transfer bar lockwork or a hammer block safety will also fire if the gun is hit hard enough on the rear of the gun. Examples are (again) the 1911, ALL Colt Single Action Army's except the Cowboy, old style S&W Revolvers w/ hammer mounted firing pins.

Very few firearms are truly "drop safe" although handguns are by far the safest of all firearms. Don't drop your shotgun!!!!

True but do you realize how incredibly hard you would have to slam the gun (a lightweight gun like the P3AT) on the ground for the firing pin to move forward with enough force to ignite the primer? I'm guessing more than enough to consider it safe.

[Guest bigbuck_tn]

You would have to hit it with exactly the same amount of force as the hammer hits it with.

Actually the lighter the gun the more likely it will be, as it will accelerate quicker when struck given the same weight firing pin.

I agree that it is very unlikely. I was only trying to make a point that "safety" is a relative term. I would choose a gun based on whether I could shoot it and I felt comfortable with it rather than it's "safety"/

[Guest bkelm18]

Yes you are correct, it would have to be the same force as the firing pin, which is quite a bit, but from hip height to the ground, acceleration is really a moot point. Not to mention a hammer strike and a ground strike are two completely different things. But like you said, safety is relative. What I think is safe may seem dangerous to someone else.

Edited April 10, 2008 by bkelm18

[Guest nraforlife]

I had a .32 Kel-Tec which was a sweet little pistol. Bought a .38 Kel-TEC which was a POS. Not reliable at all. But others swear by them.

[Guest docvantrease2003]

i have kept my kel-tec in my cruiser an carry the lcp in my pocker

[Ricochet]

I like my Kel-tec P3AT, it's very easy to conceal. It doesn't bother me that it doesn't have a safety on it, actually none of my handguns do although my CZ PCR has a decocker, my G26 doesn't have anything.

I use to think I would not want to carry a handgun without a safety on it. I am a woman and I always keep one in the chamber when carrying. If the time were to come that I need this tool for protection then not having one in the chamber could mean a sec or two changing the outcome for me.

What I learned by having handguns without a safety is that I must always handle that gun with respect, it keeps me keen and always mindful of it. In my way of thinking it is better for me to always handle that gun that way than get comfortable with a safety and then AD one because I "thought" the safety was on.

Don't get me wrong, all guns, safety or not have to be respected.

Edited April 13, 2008 by Guns&Dobes

[Guest nosnos]

Guns&dobes Im glad to hear what you had to say. I just barely bought the P3AT and also own the G26. I feel very safe with the kel tec. It is a very long trigger pull and seems that it could almost never go off accidentally.

The Glock is another story. With no safety, one in the pipe, and a lighter trigger pull than Im used to, I can't help but feel a bit wary about it. I just got my HCP and need to get a good holster for the glock. In theory I think if you don't carry with one in the chamber then you could find yourself at a serious disadvantage. I also think safeties often feel very cumbersome. But what you said about respecting ALL guns made good sense.

All that to say I love my kel tec. Still trying to adjust to the Glock. All the people who hate on Glocks make me feel like I should get something else for a bigger carry gun.

[Guest db99wj]

Guns&dobes Im glad to hear what you had to say. I just barely bought the P3AT and also own the G26. I feel very safe with the kel tec. It is a very long trigger pull and seems that it could almost never go off accidentally.

The Glock is another story. With no safety, one in the pipe, and a lighter trigger pull than Im used to, I can't help but feel a bit wary about it. I just got my HCP and need to get a good holster for the glock. In theory I think if you don't carry with one in the chamber then you could find yourself at a serious disadvantage. I also think safeties often feel very cumbersome. But what you said about respecting ALL guns made good sense.

All that to say I love my kel tec. Still trying to adjust to the Glock. All the people who hate on Glocks make me feel like I should get something else for a bigger carry gun.

Proper handling procedures is essential in handgun safety:

RULE I: ALL GUNS ARE ALWAYS LOADED

RULE II: NEVER LET THE MUZZLE COVER ANYTHING YOU ARE NOT WILLING TO DESTROY

RULE III: KEEP YOUR FINGER OFF THE TRIGGER UNTIL YOUR SIGHTS ARE ON THE TARGET

RULE IV: BE SURE OF YOUR TARGET

Glock hate is similiar, IMO, to the Ford Vs Chevy debate. There are folks that think revolvers or 1911's or ________ are the best. Just the way it is.

Glocks are good guns, they are reliable, they are reliable tools, they are safe if handled safely (like you should handle all fiearms). They have had some issues that have been pointed out on here and other places, but there is no "perfect" gun, no matter what the marketing says. Many many people out there, on this board, LEO etc carry Glocks, they trust their life on them.

Work with your gun. Shoot it, go through misfire drills, learn how to properly carry and handle your firearm. Do they have problems or break or malfunction, yes, so do all others. Take a shooting class, or a street handgun level class.

If after working with, training with, becoming proficient with your Glock you are not comfortable with it, don't trust in it, and are even scared of it, you won't carry it and if you do, you could hesitate with it and that is not good. If so, get rid of it and get something you can believe in.

To me, Glocks don't fit MY hand very well, got the small hand deal, I have shot them. They shoot very well. I carry an XD by the way.

Just my .02.

[Ricochet]

If after working with, training with, becoming proficient with your Glock you are not comfortable with it, don't trust in it, and are even scared of it, you won't carry it and if you do, you could hesitate with it and that is not good. If so, get rid of it and get something you can believe in.

Good points all the way, if I were afraid of my guns I wouldn't carry them, respecting something is one thing, being afraid is definitely another and IMO could cripple you if you ever need to use it. One of the most important things that was taught me about all this is KNOW YOUR GUN. I am familiar with my handguns, the Glock more than the others. I am not afraid it will go off, but that doesn't mean I don't think it could. I just don't constantly fear it is going off because I don't need to let fear rule me.

A true story of something that almost changed me concerning something major in my life:

I have always been a driver, there wasn't anywhere I wouldn't go, alone, with someone, or a car load, didn't matter to me, and when I moved to TN things were good, had a good car but I traded that car in on a SUV with a 4.0 motor, manual 5 speed. I had it for about 4 years and it was getting to the point that it was crippling my driving confidence because it didn't have any spunk. Now don't get me wrong, I don't need to be a zoom zoom but if I am going up a ramp to enter the interstate and there are 15 cars and a couple of 18 wheelers coming I need some SPUNK to flow into traffic but that SUV didn't have it and I started getting so nervous that I started thinking more on what could happen which added even more stress to the situation. I didn't want to go anywhere and when I did I let others drive. Last October I traded that sucker in on a Pontiac G 6 GTP and when I need to move I can move. I got my confidence back because it has the spunk to move when I want or need to move. I am no longer crippled with fear. I know that this car will do what I need it too rather than chug a lug up the ramp hoping I can flow without a big boom.

You have to know your equipment and feel comfortable with it's capibility. Your life could depend on it!

[Guest nosnos]

I think what I really need is a good holster for the Glock. I love the gun and have spent hours fiddling with snap caps and checking out the inner workings. I think it fits my hand well and I find it comfortable to shoot. I think I need a good holster.

All this to say that I have never felt uncomfortable with the KelTec in my pocket. It seems to me to be a very safe gun.

[Guest db99wj]

Good points all the way, if I were afraid of my guns I wouldn't carry them, respecting something is one thing, being afraid is definitely another and IMO could cripple you if you ever need to use it. One of the most important things that was taught me about all this is KNOW YOUR GUN. I am familiar with my handguns, the Glock more than the others. I am not afraid it will go off, but that doesn't mean I don't think it could. I just don't constantly fear it is going off because I don't need to let fear rule me.

A true story of something that almost changed me concerning something major in my life:

I have always been a driver, there wasn't anywhere I wouldn't go, alone, with someone, or a car load, didn't matter to me, and when I moved to TN things were good, had a good car but I traded that car in on a SUV with a 4.0 motor, manual 5 speed. I had it for about 4 years and it was getting to the point that it was crippling my driving confidence because it didn't have any spunk. Now don't get me wrong, I don't need to be a zoom zoom but if I am going up a ramp to enter the interstate and there are 15 cars and a couple of 18 wheelers coming I need some SPUNK to flow into traffic but that SUV didn't have it and I started getting so nervous that I started thinking more on what could happen which added even more stress to the situation. I didn't want to go anywhere and when I did I let others drive. Last October I traded that sucker in on a Pontiac G 6 GTP and when I need to move I can move. I got my confidence back because it has the spunk to move when I want or need to move. I am no longer crippled with fear. I know that this car will do what I need it too rather than chug a lug up the ramp hoping I can flow without a big boom.

You have to know your equipment and feel comfortable with it's capibility. Your life could depend on it!

I bet it was a Jeep Cherokee. They are not known for their speed, torque is or was the 4.0's cup of tea.

[Ricochet]

I bet it was a Jeep Cherokee. They are not known for their speed, torque is or was the 4.0's cup of tea.

Nope, it was a Isuzu Rodeo and I was wrong on the number, it was a 2.2 liter LOL so just imagine how hard it was to get that thang to get some energy going up a ramp

[Guest db99wj]

Nope, it was a Isuzu Rodeo and I was wrong on the number, it was a 2.2 liter LOL so just imagine how hard it was to get that thang to get some energy going up a ramp

Isn't that how much is those plastic Coke bottles?:P