What do you all think? TN Judge right or wrong?

[Luke E.]

 Buy the way, my grandmother is a retired school teacher and I remember when I was in the 4th grade her coming home on the 1st day of school that year talking about her new student "####head" of course the parents were cute and pronounced it "Shahaawd" but the kid still wrote ####head. She said it caused him trouble even in the early years.

Guess that got blurred out sh1thead was the name.

[frankmako]

parents and the judge were both wrong.  

[Guest RevScottie]

Sorry, but it absolutely matters. There are activists judges and there are those who hear cases and make decisions

based on law and precedent. This disagreement was between the parents, and she dealt with it.

 

Usually, the mother gives a name at the time of birth. I don't know the protocol after that, but, if it made it to a

judge, there is more to this story that you or I do not know. Until then, you or I could be wrong. Placing judgement

on the judge could be premature, also.

 

Get all the information before you pass judgement.

Seems you also need to "get all the information" the dispute was over the child's LAST NAME. The judge took it upon herself to change the first name. 

[Guest 6.8 AR]

Seems you also need to "get all the information" the dispute was over the child's LAST NAME. The judge took it upon herself to change the first name. 

Beg your pardon?http://www.tngunowners.com/forums/topic/68903-what-do-you-all-think-tn-judge-right-or-wrong/page-2#entry1014302

 

I doubt anyone around here knows more than this WBIR link, including me. There is probably more to it

than it only being a judge's whim religious based decision.

 

I was suggesting(to you, also) that that article didn't tell the whole story. I already figured that much out.

Edited August 13, 2013 by 6.8 AR

[tnguy]

I was suggesting(to you, also) that that article didn't tell the whole story. I already figured that much out.

 

 

The words coming out of the "judge's" mouth in the video I saw seemed to pretty much condemn her actions in my eyes. Quite horrific.

Edited August 13, 2013 by tnguy

[Guest RevScottie]

Beg your pardon?http://www.tngunowners.com/forums/topic/68903-what-do-you-all-think-tn-judge-right-or-wrong/page-2#entry1014302
 
I doubt anyone around here knows more than this WBIR link, including me. There is probably more to it
than it only being a judge's whim religious based decision.
 
I was suggesting(to you, also) that that article didn't tell the whole story. I already figured that much out.

What information that we don't know would allow this decision? The judges own words would seem to condemn her decision. There is no way it should be within her authority to do what she did.

[Guest 6.8 AR]

Things like, who took it before the judge? Did they, or a third party? I guess I missed that. Otherwise, I don't care because if

people want to name their children from Disney characters, or their favorite singer, the kid has to live with it, but when they

name a kid , like in this case, it isn't a liberal, conservative or libertarian problem. It's just, plain stupidity. I'm sure the judge

could have used a different way to say whatever she said, but I agree with her. If the child is actually the Messiah, it won't

need to be codified by a judge, and it sure won't make them a better person because of a name, wherever the origin.

 

But, you know? It's only my opinion. You can have your own. :D Personally, I would prefer people naming their children at least

learn how to spell and think first.

[Guest TankerHC]

Johnny answered the question years ago

 

http://youtu.be/-1BJfDvSITY

[Guest ThePunisher]

Personally, I would prefer people naming their children at least learn how to spell and think first.

This is the result of our liberal controlled public education system of dumbing down America. If we just pour more money into the system, and give every student a participation trophy, then the cream will rise to the top.

[SALK]

Leroy, ignorance shows lack of know better. These people are just plain stupid and out for money and attention. Judge should not have a call in the matter, BUT the parents in this case should have absolutely no say so in my opinion. Lets change the parents names to dumb and dumber.

[Dustbuster]

The next stray dog I find will be named judge anacin robitussin NyQuil Jackson Johnson Washington Davis shoots cop lollipop trey the fourth.
I dare some bastard to file a motion in court to change that name, let alone fit the name on the summons to appear .... Ill start a trust in that name. After all there's no law that says u can't make a pet a trustee to my knowledge lol....
All fun aside, I still want to know who filed what to get this heard.

[Guest RevScottie]

Why do you guys think Messiah is such a "dumb" name? It is a name rising in popularity and who are we to judge what a parent names their child? How many kids are named Mohamed? Are we going to make all of them change their names too?

[Jonnin]

Throwing gasoline on the fire my friend. Imagine how many 7 year old little boys the world would have with awesome name like "Tigerclaw Firedragon Marshall" or "Velociraptor B Jones" there would be running around if you let 6year olds pick their names.

Personally I'm gonna go with personal freedom and responsibility on this one and say the current system of letting parents pick their children's name and the kids keeping it until either they convince their parents to change it or they are old enough to change it themselves.

It's not a perfect system, but the vast overwhelming majority of the time, it works.

 

That is why 12 would decide, when normally a judge alone could do it, as I said.   If 7/12 people think the name is idiotic, that is good enough for me.   The kid and parents can then submit new names to the 12 until 7/12 approve the new name.  That should limit the stupidity.    I dunno maybe not the best idea, but a kid has to have SOME way to protest and apparently we can't have a single activist judge making the decision.   Actually if I had my way judges would make NO decisions beyond applying the sentence after a conviction and maintaining order in the process, but that is another story.    The biggest issue would be wasting courtroom time on nonsense ---- oh wait.  Actually a kid's name is more important than probably 30% of the crap taken to court.

[JayC]

No!  This is no better than 1 judge telling somebody what to do...  Show me in the state or federal constitution what power gives them the authority to dictate how I name my child?  I'll give you a hint it isn't there.

 

If a child doesn't like their name, when they turn 18 they can go to the court and get it changed easily.

 

I don't have any right whatsoever to force you to name your child anything...  

 

That is why 12 would decide, when normally a judge alone could do it, as I said.   If 7/12 people think the name is idiotic, that is good enough for me.   The kid and parents can then submit new names to the 12 until 7/12 approve the new name.  That should limit the stupidity.    I dunno maybe not the best idea, but a kid has to have SOME way to protest and apparently we can't have a single activist judge making the decision.   Actually if I had my way judges would make NO decisions beyond applying the sentence after a conviction and maintaining order in the process, but that is another story.    The biggest issue would be wasting courtroom time on nonsense ---- oh wait.  Actually a kid's name is more important than probably 30% of the crap taken to court.

Edited August 14, 2013 by JayC

[Guest 6.8 AR]

I agree with the libertarian argument, just so you know, you guys. I don't think anyone else should be naming someone else's

child for them. I do, however think popularity is a poor excuse for a child's name. That's kinda like mob rule for baby names.

 

One of the most popular names for muslim babies is Muhammed(sp?). Years ago, somewhere I saw an article about baby names.

It was about the time when "Ashley" was the most popular. Years later, I can't keep all the Ashleys straight. That's not a big deal,

though, but when a couple can't agree on the naming of their child, it makes me scratch my head, regardless of what a judge

does.

 

Any empathy I have is pointed at the child having to bear whatever name whoever gives it to them. My first name "Mark" could have

been from St.Mark, or an ancestor. My last name, which is what the judge was supposed to rule on, I think, in my case, is Berwind,

which is my family name. Maybe it's just me, but it makes sense. I'm just thanking God my parents didn't have some brain fart and

name me Muhammed Berwind 'cause I would have to get that one changed.

 

The judge made a decision is all I see. They went before her, either by their petition, or someone else's petition. Whoever did that

is who I would lay some kind of blame on, and not the just the judge for injecting her beliefs.

[Guest nra37922]

Decades ago, early 70's, I had an English Prof in college, he was an anti-war Chicago Seven type of clown, name his child Stev3n.  Not Steven but Stev3n said he did it so the government could never enter his legal name on any form.

[Luke E.]

That is why 12 would decide, when normally a judge alone could do it, as I said.   If 7/12 people think the name is idiotic, that is good enough for me.   The kid and parents can then submit new names to the 12 until 7/12 approve the new name.  That should limit the stupidity.    I dunno maybe not the best idea, but a kid has to have SOME way to protest and apparently we can't have a single activist judge making the decision.   Actually if I had my way judges would make NO decisions beyond applying the sentence after a conviction and maintaining order in the process, but that is another story.    The biggest issue would be wasting courtroom time on nonsense ---- oh wait.  Actually a kid's name is more important than probably 30% of the crap taken to court.

 

 That would be mob rule which is what democracy boils down to and it just doesn't work... for long. We live, at least for the time being, in a constitutional republic and should stick with what works most of the time. The humane side of me thinks that someone should step in if a child is going to be named "satan" or "sh1t for brains" but that kinda opens up and can of worms huh. I think we've run full circle several times now and until we know the whole story (as 6.8 has stated) I don't think we're going to get anywhere.

[Guest TankerHC]

I agree with the libertarian argument, just so you know, you guys. I don't think anyone else should be naming someone else's

child for them. I do, however think popularity is a poor excuse for a child's name. That's kinda like mob rule for baby names.

 

One of the most popular names for muslim babies is Muhammed(sp?). Years ago, somewhere I saw an article about baby names.

It was about the time when "Ashley" was the most popular. Years later, I can't keep all the Ashleys straight. That's not a big deal,

though, but when a couple can't agree on the naming of their child, it makes me scratch my head, regardless of what a judge

does.

 

Any empathy I have is pointed at the child having to bear whatever name whoever gives it to them. My first name "Mark" could have

been from St.Mark, or an ancestor. My last name, which is what the judge was supposed to rule on, I think, in my case, is Berwind,

which is my family name. Maybe it's just me, but it makes sense. I'm just thanking God my parents didn't have some brain fart and

name me Muhammed Berwind 'cause I would have to get that one changed.

 

The judge made a decision is all I see. They went before her, either by their petition, or someone else's petition. Whoever did that

is who I would lay some kind of blame on, and not the just the judge for injecting her beliefs.

 

Was reading a while back about baby names. Saw that when I was born, my name, Jeff, was in the top 15. Today its not even in the top 200.

[Jonnin]

Somehow we went from a kid being able to make up their own mind that their name (lets call the example child "wasted-sperm jones")  is offensive to mob rule and anarchy and dictatorships. 

 

All I said was that Wasted-Sperm (not his teacher, not his cousin, not his buddy, not some random idiot off the street) himself, finding his name to be offensive and to generally degrade his self image and quality of life,  should be able to do something about BEFORE he reaches the insane high age of 18.  18 years is way, way too long to live out one's life being referred to as Wasted-Sperm.   I think 6-8 years is more than long enough for the kid to decide that something needs to be done, and he should have a way to do by that age IF and ONLY IF he wants to and IF and ONLY IF the majority of randomly selected people on a jury agree that his name is beyond the pale. 

 

If that is too much common sense to ask for, well, we knew america was doomed years ago.

 

If this infringes on the freedoms of the parents, I do not see it.  At some point, the kid has some rights too.  And those rights come before age 18 IMHO.   If you really read what I said, all I am really saying is to allow the reduction of the age at which a name can be changed under specific circumstances (the individual with the name is desperate to get it changed, and a majority of randomly selected adults agree with the kid).   I am all about the libertarian stuff until it affects other people, but here, the right of the parents to name the kid has to stop when it reaches a point that the kid is now a subject of ridicule and torment and so on to the point that its quality of life is affected.   If the parents want to rename themselves to whatever awful name, I am all for it.

 

 

What I did not agree with is renaming the child on behalf of anyone else (only the child can register the complaint).  I did not allow for the judge to provide a new name (the child or parents must produce this).  It is not so much telling parents what they CAN name the child as telling them what they CANNOT name the child and forcing an alternative to be suggested.   Unfortunately, these sorts of things really need to be --- because without them, it won't be long before we DO see names like G**D*** M***FK**  Smith or worse.  

[JPS]

No!  This is no better than 1 judge telling somebody what to do...  Show me in the state or federal constitution what power gives them the authority to dictate how I name my child?  I'll give you a hint it isn't there.

 

If a child doesn't like their name, when they turn 18 they can go to the court and get it changed easily.

 

I don't have any right whatsoever to force you to name your child anything...  

 

This is exactly right.  I may think that a name some parent gives their kid is the stupidest thing I've ever heard, but neither I or any one else has any right to take that decision away from the parents.  I'm guessing this Judge's decision will be overturned at first opportunity.

[Jonnin]

This is exactly right.  I may think that a name some parent gives their kid is the stupidest thing I've ever heard, but neither I or any one else has any right to take that decision away from the parents.  I'm guessing this Judge's decision will be overturned at first opportunity.

 

What about the child?   I agree with not me, not you, not the judge, or anyone else.   Does the child have the right to a reasonable name?

[JPS]

What about the child?   I agree with not me, not you, not the judge, or anyone else.   Does the child have the right to a reasonable name?

 

Absolutely.  It sucks that they have to wait until they are legal age to address the stupidity of their parents, but thats the way it is.  I'm sure that my kids would love to have a 'legal option' to over-rule some of my parenting decisions, but they're stuck with me making those decisions until they're 18.

[three5seven]

The judge's actions were ridiculous--especially her giving the press comments. She likely violated the Establishment Clause of the Federal Constitution and Art. I, S. 3 of the Tennessee Constitution. More importantly for her, the judge's actions violated the Tennessee Code of Judicial conduct. She's opened herself to removal and/or impeachment for her behavior. After all of the negative press she's received, I wouldn't be surprised if some member of the TN General Assembly initiates the process.   

[TMF]

What about the child? I agree with not me, not you, not the judge, or anyone else. Does the child have the right to a reasonable name?

That's like asking if the child has a right to non-idiot parents. Sure he does, but that's not what he's gonna get. I feel bad for kids whose parents give them dumb names, but setting a precedent where the court makes that choice for you is a subjective slippery slope.

[Guest Keal G Seo]

I thought I'd give an update here. Ruling was overturned and baby keeps his name.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/tenn-judge-parents-baby-messiah-20292026