Talked about before!!!!

[pop pop]

When one is in his yard and outside, you are very vulnerable. I had an incident several years ago, where 3 guys attacked me while on the way to the mailbox 300 feet away. I was really easy prey as I had just had knee surgery and was mostly walking with the aid of a walking stick, to exercise and rehab my knee. I could not get away from them and they knew it. I was forced to face down the driver and another monster 6" 3" and 280 pounder. Both had fire in their eyes. The monster told his buddy "It ain't worth getting shot over," and that is the only thing that stopped them. 

I carry even at home now. These thugs left me alone and drove across the hill (4 MI) and attacked a friend, doing the same thing, and beat him and left him lying in his house after robbing and stealing everything they wanted out of his house. He stayed in the hospital 3 weeks and died 1 week after coming home. He was 84 and legally blind. Could only see the ground just in front of his shoes. His son told me his dad died from the beating he took that day. Said his dad never got out of the bed after his beating. 

Don't think it can't happen guys. A Bersa 380 would have made the difference, Bersaguy. I had a 7 shot 357 in my pocket and would have used if I had been forced too. I am convinced that is the only reason I was not the one receiving the beating. My mistake was not calling the Sherriff and reporting these thugs. Their truck was seen, by neighbors, parked on the side of the road that morning in front of his house. 

Us old people were taught not to call 911. That is WRONG. CALL ASAP. 

Edited to add; I tell this story every chance I get. I want people, for sure us old guys, to learn from it and don't be as lame as I was by not calling the Sherriff. Just might have saved my neighbor his beating, and who knows his life. 

 

Edited 15 hours ago by pop pop

[leroy]

Pop pop...

Good Heavens Brother..!  It can happen.  I never don't have a pistola on me just because of what you just related...

leroy.

[papa61]

17 hours ago, deerslayer said:

We have to mow our grass with a Mossberg 590 on a 2 point sling around our neck in my neighborhood

 

11 hours ago, 10-Ring said:

I've never had issues, but I like to be ready for issues. 

I usually pocket carry daily, most often even out doing yardwork. I've been trying to re-design a chest rig with a flap for over a year and not gotten it to work to my satisfaction (sorry @Darrell). This has shown me a good use for the Shockwave. Already have a machete on the mower, might as well make a scabbard and get the Shockwave. Any excuse to tell the wife I NEED a new gun  
Seriously, my two Danes keep the crackheads at bay but one is quite vulnerable while mowing. Wearing hearing protection and concentrating on where you point the mower would make it easy for someone to slip up on you.

[pop pop]

papa61, you are correct. The 3 guys that got after me were all high on something. Their eyes were dilated and one of the 3 was laughing uncontrollably while exiting the truck. He never stopped laughing even driving away. Two of them were advancing on me very quickly. The driver, who was first in line, never batted his eyes from the time he left the driver seat until he looked back at his monster buddy who had stopped advancing toward me and told him it aint worth getting shot over. The black of the drivers' eyes looked the size of a dime to me. He had already flexed his arms upward and made fist with his hands just before stopping. He was going to knock me into tomorrow if he got close enough. He got to within 25 feet from me before giving it up. I had my hand on my revolver grip and started my draw stroke when big guy spoke up. I was extremely glad when they stopped. I never want to shoot anyone if I can get away.

They cursed me until they got down the road. 

No doubt in my mind, they were crack heads or something. My friend they robbed was always known to carry a big role of cash on him. I talked to him about that. 

[deerslayer]

2 hours ago, pop pop said:

When one is in his yard and outside, you are very vulnerable. I had an incident several years ago, where 3 guys attacked me while on the way to the mailbox 300 feet away. I was really easy prey as I had just had knee surgery and was mostly walking with the aid of a walking stick, to exercise and rehab my knee. I could not get away from them and they knew it. I was forced to face down the driver and another monster 6" 3" and 280 pounder. Both had fire in their eyes. The monster told his buddy "It ain't worth getting shot over," and that is the only thing that stopped them. 

I carry even at home now. These thugs left me alone and drove across the hill (4 MI) and attacked a friend, doing the same thing, and beat him and left him lying in his house after robbing and stealing everything they wanted out of his house. He stayed in the hospital 3 weeks and died 1 week after coming home. He was 84 and legally blind. Could only see the ground just in front of his shoes. His son told me his dad died from the beating he took that day. Said his dad never got out of the bed after his beating. 

Don't think it can't happen guys. A Bersa 380 would have made the difference, Bersaguy. I had a 7 shot 357 in my pocket and would have used if I had been forced too. I am convinced that is the only reason I was not the one receiving the beating. My mistake was not calling the Sherriff and reporting these thugs. Their truck was seen, by neighbors, parked on the side of the road that morning in front of his house. 

Us old people were taught not to call 911. That is WRONG. CALL ASAP. 

Edited to add; I tell this story every chance I get. I want people, for sure us old guys, to learn from it and don't be as lame as I was by not calling the Sherriff. Just might have saved my neighbor his beating, and who knows his life. 

 

Hopefully karma catches up to those fellows. 

 

1 hour ago, papa61 said:

 

I usually pocket carry daily, most often even out doing yardwork. I've been trying to re-design a chest rig with a flap for over a year and not gotten it to work to my satisfaction (sorry @Darrell). This has shown me a good use for the Shockwave. Already have a machete on the mower, might as well make a scabbard and get the Shockwave. Any excuse to tell the wife I NEED a new gun  
Seriously, my two Danes keep the crackheads at bay but one is quite vulnerable while mowing. Wearing hearing protection and concentrating on where you point the mower would make it easy for someone to slip up on you.

I feel like pocket carry is a compromise, but sometimes I resort to a pocket 9mm or .38 while doing yard work.  You are definitely vulnerable while running a mower or weed eater, especially if wearing earpro or listening to music or podcasts.  No .380 for me though - like somebody above pointed out, it makes no sense to carry a 9mm sized .380, unless controlling the gun is an issue.  

[papa61]

1 hour ago, deerslayer said:

Hopefully karma catches up to those fellows. 

 

I feel like pocket carry is a compromise, but sometimes I resort to a pocket 9mm or .38 while doing yard work.  You are definitely vulnerable while running a mower or weed eater, especially if wearing earpro or listening to music or podcasts.  No .380 for me though - like somebody above pointed out, it makes no sense to carry a 9mm sized .380, unless controlling the gun is an issue.  

Everything about this is a compromise. Size, weight, controllability, concealability, accuracy, round capacity. It's all subject to threat level and mission. Handguns are, for the most part, defensive weapons. If I were forced to go to Seattle during the BLM protests I wouldn't carry a handgun willingly. No, a good 12ga and an AR would be my choice for that situation. What we carry is based on multiple factors. How we carry is also. I could ask, Why carry a 45 sized 9mm unless controlling the gun is an issue?

[deerslayer]

9 minutes ago, papa61 said:

Everything about this is a compromise. Size, weight, controllability, concealability, accuracy, round capacity. It's all subject to threat level and mission. Handguns are, for the most part, defensive weapons. If I were forced to go to Seattle during the BLM protests I wouldn't carry a handgun willingly. No, a good 12ga and an AR would be my choice for that situation. What we carry is based on multiple factors. How we carry is also. I could ask, Why carry a 45 sized 9mm unless controlling the gun is an issue?

That could be a valid question, but I’ve never carried a .45 sized 9mm.  If I did, I would argue that the dropoff between .45 and 9mm effectiveness is negligible, but the dropoff between 9mm and .380 is significant.  Capacity could be another reason.  
 

.45 and 9mm (and many other handgun calibers) suck for manstopping, but they suck less than .380 and are no harder for me to carry.  The big benefit of handguns is that they are convenient to carry in case there is unexpected trouble.  If I knew I couldn’t avoid trouble, I would have my M&P 10 instead of a handgun.  

[papa61]

1 hour ago, deerslayer said:

That could be a valid question, but I’ve never carried a .45 sized 9mm.  If I did, I would argue that the dropoff between .45 and 9mm effectiveness is negligible, but the dropoff between 9mm and .380 is significant.  Capacity could be another reason.  
 

.45 and 9mm (and many other handgun calibers) suck for manstopping, but they suck less than .380 and are no harder for me to carry.  The big benefit of handguns is that they are convenient to carry in case there is unexpected trouble.  If I knew I couldn’t avoid trouble, I would have my M&P 10 instead of a handgun.  

If I knew I couldn't avoid trouble I would maneuver around it. I'm probably one of the few that has had a sidearm as my primary weapon. I was an APC driver in a scout platoon, no place to put an AR16 or even a grease gun, which we still had in the arsenal. That makes me comfortable saying maneuver around it. I think we agree somewhat. SO my entire point here is at what level are you comfortable? Do you wear body armor when you go out? Do you carry a trauma/first aid kit? Do you have a long gun available in your vehicle? If I play the odds, odds are I will never encounter a situation where I need a firearm. If I do, odds are it will be within ten feet and over in three shots. My pocket rocket weighs less than whatever you carry in 9mm. In fact it weighs less than a good fighting knife. So it always goes with me. At seven yards I can put six rounds on a ten inch plate before you can land three on the same target. I practice with it 99% of my range visits, I know it will hit where I point. (what sights)?

With all of that, if I were picking a 9mm why would I pick glock over hi point? (Neither thank you)

 

edit: forgot to add, with 7 yards three shot odds, .357 mag 125gr SJHP is undisputed top of the heap for one shot stops, ballistic gel tests and all other tests. Results vary of course with barrel length but all things equal, it wins. Nope, don't carry one of those either by personal choice.

Edited 10 hours ago by papa61

[gun sane]

I hope to God I'm not minimizing the risks too much, but a 9mm or .380 with one full magazine seems to handle quite well the minor dustups we might encounter here in the eastern third of the state.  We don't have so much crime and commotion that we have to pack like we're defending the Alamo. But I can use them to fight my way to a shotgun or rifle, if need be.

[deerslayer]

1 hour ago, papa61 said:

My pocket rocket weighs less than whatever you carry in 9mm. In fact it weighs less than a good fighting knife. So it always goes with me. At seven yards I can put six rounds on a ten inch plate before you can land three on the same target. 

Mmmmmm I doubt that.  

[papa61]

6 minutes ago, deerslayer said:

Mmmmmm I doubt that.  

even a Baby Browning 25 weighs more

 

Edited 8 hours ago by papa61

[deerslayer]

19 minutes ago, papa61 said:

even a Baby Browning 25 weighs more

 

I wasn’t talking about your gun’s weight.  I was talking about your six hits being quicker than my three hits.  If we were closer, we could have a friendly wager and you could eat those words with ranch dressing.  

[papa61]

3 minutes ago, deerslayer said:

I wasn’t talking about your gun’s weight.  I was talking about your six hits being quicker than my three hits.  If we were closer, we could have a friendly wager and you could eat those words with ranch dressing.  

oh THAT part. Yeah I already have a long drive to a range, Bartlett is out of the question. But I would enjoy the steak and beer you'd buy.  

[deerslayer]

Just now, papa61 said:

oh THAT part. Yeah I already have a long drive to a range, Bartlett is out of the question. But I would enjoy the steak and beer you'd buy.  

Ok

[gun sane]

Edited 8 hours ago by gun sane

[papa61]

2 hours ago, gun sane said:

Move along, nothing to see here. If things didn't get heated over caliber it's all good. I'd be more worried if deerslayer didn't have the confidence to challenge the speed shooting. 

Hey @deerslayer, your last name isn't Miculek is it?

[Garufa]

We need to have a TGO showdown.  A friendly shootenanny to slap leather and throw down.  

[pop pop]

Not trying to be argumentative or sarcastic here guys. 

Quote (papa61) If I play the odds, odds are I will never encounter a situation where I need a firearm. If I do, odds are it will be within ten feet and over in three shots.

I had been going to the mailbox safely for 30 years prior to my incident. I never expected to run into 3 crack heads (????) while going to the mailbox that day pappa. But I did. If I had known I would have stayed in the house and stretched my knee. 

I only had 7 on board in my 357 so I would have needed to put them where they would count against 3 attackers. Made me stop and think do I have enough on board???? Tell you the truth, that is why I purchased the Bodyguard 380 as weak side backup when we go RVing. One is really out there when stopping for fuel. Diesel is, most times, always on the ends of the pump islands and as far away as they can be from the office/stop and rob. 

[leroy]

Folks...

Ya would be surprised what can happen in the blink of an eye while ya are minding your own business. 

About a year ago, I had a dust up with an idiot who thought I had taken a photo of one of his kids in a public setting ( I didn't).  He threatened to drag me out of my vehicle and beat me to death. 

I calmly advised him that if he tried; bad things would happen, and he met my trusty little friend from SIG... Luckily he retreated and called the police... They dismissed him n told him to go on home.

Yes, there are idiots n thugs out there that think slapping old geezers around is ok.  They sometimes come out of nowhere.  Us geezers look to be relatively easy targets.  Some of us ain't.

leroy...

[Choatecav]

9 hours ago, pop pop said:

When one is in his yard and outside, you are very vulnerable. I had an incident several years ago, where 3 guys attacked me while on the way to the mailbox 300 feet away. I was really easy prey as I had just had knee surgery and was mostly walking with the aid of a walking stick, to exercise and rehab my knee. I could not get away from them and they knew it. I was forced to face down the driver and another monster 6" 3" and 280 pounder. Both had fire in their eyes. The monster told his buddy "It ain't worth getting shot over," and that is the only thing that stopped them. 

I carry even at home now. These thugs left me alone and drove across the hill (4 MI) and attacked a friend, doing the same thing, and beat him and left him lying in his house after robbing and stealing everything they wanted out of his house. He stayed in the hospital 3 weeks and died 1 week after coming home. He was 84 and legally blind. Could only see the ground just in front of his shoes. His son told me his dad died from the beating he took that day. Said his dad never got out of the bed after his beating. 

Don't think it can't happen guys. A Bersa 380 would have made the difference, Bersaguy. I had a 7 shot 357 in my pocket and would have used if I had been forced too. I am convinced that is the only reason I was not the one receiving the beating. My mistake was not calling the Sherriff and reporting these thugs. Their truck was seen, by neighbors, parked on the side of the road that morning in front of his house. 

Us old people were taught not to call 911. That is WRONG. CALL ASAP. 

Edited to add; I tell this story every chance I get. I want people, for sure us old guys, to learn from it and don't be as lame as I was by not calling the Sherriff. Just might have saved my neighbor his beating, and who knows his life. 

 

That's a helluva story, buddy.  No doubt the gun you were carrying was your salvation.  I live out in the country on a horse farm but the same thing could happen anywhere.  You sure were lucky and I don't doubt that you now carry even at home.  Great lesson to be learned.  

Oh, and I am late sixties and I never was taught not to call 911.  

[deerslayer]

1 hour ago, papa61 said:

Hey @deerslayer, your last name isn't Miculek is it?

Nope

43 minutes ago, Garufa said:

We need to have a TGO showdown.  A friendly shootenanny to slap leather and throw down.  

I shoot left handed and just had rotator cuff surgery on my left shoulder BUT I would win that bet shooting weak hand only.
 

papa61, bring your car title.  I’ll even give you a ride home.  

Edited 5 hours ago by deerslayer

[Garufa]

Whoops.

Edited 5 hours ago by Garufa
Comprehension

[deerslayer]

4 minutes ago, Garufa said:

That’s the second time in this thread that has been mentioned and I don’t understand it.  Why not call the law?  

I think he meant he was NOT taught that. 

[papa61]

26 minutes ago, pop pop said:

Not trying to be argumentative or sarcastic here guys. 

Quote (papa61) If I play the odds, odds are I will never encounter a situation where I need a firearm. If I do, odds are it will be within ten feet and over in three shots.

I had been going to the mailbox safely for 30 years prior to my incident. I never expected to run into 3 crack heads (????) while going to the mailbox that day pappa. But I did. If I had known I would have stayed in the house and stretched my knee. 

I only had 7 on board in my 357 so I would have needed to put them where they would count against 3 attackers. Made me stop and think do I have enough on board???? Tell you the truth, that is why I purchased the Bodyguard 380 as weak side backup when we go RVing. One is really out there when stopping for fuel. Diesel is, most times, always on the ends of the pump islands and as far away as they can be from the office/stop and rob. 

Oh I am not saying it won't happen to me or that it will happen within the average statistics. I'm saying we can't walk around with a heavy load of bang nor can we prep for every situation. I personally let myself get to close to a thug who pulled a knife. I was counting steps backward and put my hand on my pistol, I was at 2 1/2 when someone with a cool head called him back. At three the boy's day would have ended very badly. And at 63 with the physical issues I have I'm not letting any possible threat get that close.

[papa61]

29 minutes ago, deerslayer said:

Nope

I shoot left handed and just had rotator cuff surgery on my left shoulder BUT I would win that bet shooting weak hand only.
 

papa61, bring your car title.  I’ll even give you a ride home.  

Sorry, not funny about the shoulder bud, I was laughing that you'd think I'd need a ride.

I refuse to have that surgery at my age, one of the nursing techs at my doctor's office had it and I'm not going through that.