VCDL - Manassas City Police Abuse of Authority

[TGO David]

Have any of you seen this before?

http://www.vcdl.org/Tonys/mcpd.html

VERY interesting reading material. It really drives home the fact that, as others here have stated before, the Law is whatever the Police say it is at the moment and you're often left to spend a lot of money to prove otherwise after the fact.

[Guest Old Chief]

It is apparent that the LEO's in this case feel that they have the right to make the laws in a way that they want to enforce them. This seems to be a common reality in some communities.

[Mark@Sea]

That also happened lately in Norfolk. The guy has a very clear cut civil suit (he was actually arrested, but the prosecutor dropped the charges like a hot potato). His wife may also have a suit - they threatened to arrest her when she attempted to video the crap they were giving her husband, then left her in downtown norfolk with the children - refusing to give her the keys to the family car.

Also Hampton, where the police have arrested one guy 3 times, and told him that they would arrest him, and run a trace on his pistol, EVERY time they see him. Every time, they handcuff and hold him for an hour or so, then release him. I anticipate that guy is going to experience a sudden windfall in the not-too-distant future.

Those guys are NEARLY as professional as the KPD.

[molonlabetn]

In that instance, they were not enforcing any 'law'... if they had been, there would have been arrests made. As it was, they were simply intimidating people who's practices they did not agree with, legality be damned.

[SkWaShDeM]

I've heard quite a bit about this, a friend of mine was one of the guys at the pizza place during that incident. I'm also a member of the VCDL, so I got the email updates during the entire debacle. MCPD is among my least favorite jurisdictions as a result.

[Marswolf]

Virginia seems to have a problem with LE and city officials ignoring state law. In Bristol, the city hall is posted and the city manager knows that is against state code. It's going to take some attorney or group suing the hell out of one of these cities before it will get taken care of. It would help if Virginia had an AG who had some balls too.

[SkWaShDeM]

Virginia seems to have a problem with LE and city officials ignoring state law. In Bristol, the city hall is posted and the city manager knows that is against state code. It's going to take some attorney or group suing the hell out of one of these cities before it will get taken care of. It would help if Virginia had an AG who had some balls too.

The AG up there isn't so bad... He finally sent Bloomberg a cease & desist letter... Six months after people started asking him to do so. It'd probably help more if they'd get rid of Tim Kaine in the next governor's election and replaced him with someone who will actually be pro-gun.

[Marswolf]

I don't think Kaine can run again.

Glad the AG could write New York. Why can't he write Manassas and Bristol?

[Smith]

I fully support our Police officers, but that one guy Clod whatever is a jerk! I am emailing the chief and tell him so.

[DaveTN]

They were called by a citizen; they had no choice to respond. Our dispatchers weren’t Police Officers and they didn’t decide over the phone if any laws were being broken on a man with a gun call. Could you imagine the liability to the department and the city if they didn’t send anyone and an innocent citizen got shot?

<O:p</O:p

The guy that wrote that seems pretty proud of the fact that they all refused to show ID and they never did show any. (Which I highly doubt.) I’m guessing the situation went down hill as soon as he opened his mouth.

<O:p</O:p

I wonder what would have happened if they would have just shown ID and the cop explained that he has to check these things out when called; told them to enjoy their dinner and left?

<O:p</O:p

I don’t know <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" /><st1:State>Virginia </st1:State>law. Does <st1:State>Virginia</st1:State> not require a permit for open carry?

<O:p</O:p

[SkWaShDeM]

Virginia does -not- require a permit for open carry. You can open carry at age 18. You are not required to show ID when open carrying. You are required to have ID on you when carrying -concealed-. The guys at the pizza place didn't show ID because they were not legally required to.

Virginia's carry law requires open carry in restaurants that serve alcohol that are not posted as no-carry. They were simply following that law. The guy who called the cops was from Massachusetts and was unable to understand that open carriage of a firearm was perfectly legal.

[towerclimber37]

in other words, the jackass that called the police just wanted to start trouble.

what a chickenhead

[Marswolf]

in other words, the jackass that called the police just wanted to start trouble.

That;s my reading on it.

But the police should have come in, seen the situation, and just left.

[K191145]

in other words, the jackass that called the police just wanted to start trouble.

what a chickenhead

Well this explains it right here.

The guy who called the cops was from Massachusetts

New England blue state liberal mentality.

[Mark@Sea]

Gee, I'm from out of state, and I'm in a restaraunt.

Half a dozen armed men come in, sit down, and order. No unusual reactions from the proprieter, servers, or other guests.

What do I do? Ask my server if thats' legal, or even unusual? Shrug and eat my dinner? Or shriek like a little girl - strike that, a little girl would've handled it better - and call 911?

And people wonder why we make fun of Yankees......

[SkWaShDeM]

http://www.vcdl.org/Tonys/Tonys_911.mp3

That's the link to the 911 call recording that VCDL got from their FOIA request.

[TGO David]

http://www.vcdl.org/Tonys/Tonys_911.mp3

That's the link to the 911 call recording that VCDL got from their FOIA request.

Ya know... I guess it's possible for a few pansies to slip through the Crucible every know and again, but I've never met a former Marine who acted like as much of a whiney little bitch as this guy did. He needs a free pass back through Parris Island to get his world re-aligned.

[Guest Boomhower]

"6 males that aren't certified officers, agents, FBI, or anything".....blah blah blah.....Who cares. The only certification they are required to have is the handgun carrying permit certification. This guy needs to wake up and realize that he isn't the only one in this world. Quite frankly, It's very upsetting to me to see a former member of our armed forces stirring the pot like this. Someone that has served his county and fought for the very rights/privileges that these 6 males have, and even himself if he so pleased.<O:p</O:p

<O:p</O:p

On another note, I can see how this situation could get out of hand rather quickly. Obviously, there is no excuse for the actions of the officer's after they were on scene, but I could imagine (and I think the voice of the one officer says it quite well “did you say 6 people armed”) the shock level of this call coming over the radio. However, dispatch should have stated the caller’s claim of “their not causing any trouble”. This could have deescalated the situation before the arrival of the officer’s. Either way you spin it, it all boils down to the actions afterwards.<O:p</O:p

<O:p</O:p

Question: Do you guys think that fear overwhelms officers in these types of situations and causes them to make bad decisions?<O:p</O:p

[towerclimber37]

And people wonder why we make fun of Yankees......

I had a guy actually tell me (when I was working up in Mn. (he was from SD) that people from the south were all just ignorant trash.

I told him that I speak 3 languages, have been to 4 out of the 7 continents and am not that far away from a batchelors degree in science...and I added that I would be happy to whip his ass any time he called the tune.

he quit talking to me after that. *sigh* I need to work on my diplomacy.

I would like to add that rarely do I meet a yankee that I dislike...but it HAS happened.

The only certification they are required to have is the handgun carrying permit certification.

correct me if I'm wrong but in virginia you don't need a permit to carry openly do you?

[DaveTN]

Question: Do you guys think that fear overwhelms officers in these types of situations and causes them to make bad decisions?<O:p</O:p

I don’t think that was the case here, but on calls like domestic violence or calls to stop a vehicle were someone has said the subject is armed or has threatened to use a gun; you bet fear and adrenalin has an impact on decisions. When I went on those types of calls there was no discussion about what was going on until I located and secured the weapon. That’s not overreaction; that’s just training and common sense.

<O:p</O:p

Cops are human and they make mistakes.

[SkWaShDeM]

correct me if I'm wrong but in virginia you don't need a permit to carry openly do you?

Correct. Open carry is legal at age 18 in Virginia with no permit of any kind.