How good are your groups from your AR with a scope?

[jeff43]

Just wondering what size of groups people are getting form their AR15's with scopes?I've got a Bushmaster XM15 E2S model AR 16" bbl,flat top with a Nikon Prostaff 3x9x40 scope.I've shot some PMC bronze and loaded some Sierra 69 grain Match Kings with 25 grains of IMR4320.About the best group I've got is 2 inches.I can shoot these from my Savage model 10 Precision Carbine ,and Stevens model 200 .223's and get around 1/2" groups or better.I got the AR used a couple of years ago and just put a scope on it to see what it would do.
Jeff

[gregintenn]

I don't have an AR, but my ol' pappy has a Colt HBAR that'll shoot dime sized groups at 100 yards with it's favorite handload.

My mini 14 Ruger is getting 2-3' groups with most everything I've tried.

[Dolomite_supafly]

With factory ammo 1" at 100 yards is pretty damn good. I would say yours is average with factory ammo for most AR's out there. Might try a few other brands to see if it improves.

Now with handloads it is a completely different story. It is possible to cut groups substantially with handloads. One of my AR's shoots consistent 2" groups at 100 yards using factory ammo. It will shoot .75" groups using my handloads.

And you can't compare a Savage to an AR. Almost any Savage will shoot circles around any AR. I mean my 223 Savage shoots .3" groups with handloads.

Dolomite

[LI0NSFAN]

My AR and Mini 14 get the same groupings with the same ammo. I get 1-2 inch groups at 100yds with Federal black box stuff and 1/2 inch with stuff hand loaded by a friend. All of this was tested on a gun rest to take my incompetence out of it. Edited November 25, 2012 by Lions Fan

[Raoul]

using a Caldwell lead sled I managed 2 consecutive shots dead center at 200 yards. Scope was a Tasco 3x12.

[jeff43]

The groups just seems like they aren't consitant,sometimes one here,one there,not tight..Barrel may need a good cleaning.I'm gonna try some more different ammo and loads.
Jeff Edited November 26, 2012 by jeff43

[gregintenn]

Personally, I can't do all that well with a military two stage trigger.

[jeff43]

[quote name='Dolomite_supafly' timestamp='1353885839' post='850573']
With factory ammo 1" at 100 yards is pretty damn good. I would say yours is average with factory ammo for most AR's out there. Might try a few other brands to see if it improves.

Now with handloads it is a completely different story. It is possible to cut groups substantially with handloads. One of my AR's shoots consistent 2" groups at 100 yards using factory ammo. It will shoot .75" groups using my handloads.

And you can't compare a Savage to an AR. Almost any Savage will shoot circles around any AR. I mean my 223 Savage shoots .3" groups with handloads.

Dolomite
[/quote]

What powder and weight bullet are you using?

[TLRMADE]

I've had my bushmaster moe for almost two years now. It's a Bushmaster XM15 just like yours. I've put thousands of rounds through it. I would estimate 5k plus or minus a few. It has gotten more accurate the more I've shot it. Some say bc the chrome lining is wearing out and that's why it's becoming more accurate. I've found my best accuracy came from Hornady Vmax 55gr. That's what I used for coyote hunting and deer hunting. So that's what I was using sighting it in with. The majority of the rounds I've ran through it are the steel cased wolf.

[Dave Shooter]

In their Gas Gun Basics video JP shoots some 100 yard groups in the .2-.3 inch range. Those aren't run of the mill ARs by any means.

I'm happy with minute of angle at 300 yards from my 3 gun rifle. I'm not great at shooting groups.

[jeff43]

[quote name='TLRMADE' timestamp='1353897866' post='850657']
I've had my bushmaster moe for almost two years now. It's a Bushmaster XM15 just like yours. I've put thousands of rounds through it. I would estimate 5k plus or minus a few. It has gotten more accurate the more I've shot it. Some say bc the chrome lining is wearing out and that's why it's becoming more accurate. I've found my best accuracy came from Hornady Vmax 55gr. That's what I used for coyote hunting and deer hunting. So that's what I was using sighting it in with. The majority of the rounds I've ran through it are the steel cased wolf.
[/quote]
I've shot Wolf,WPA steel cased through mine.It's fairly accurate,but sticks in the chamber when it gets hot.I don't know how many rds. mine has had through it,the bore looks great though.As far as accuracy I guess I'm just used to bolt gun accuracy.You just always hear people talk about how accurate AR's are,guess I'm expecting too much.
Jeff Edited November 26, 2012 by jeff43

[Guest J.boyette]

My MK12MOD2L gets about 3/4 MOA with match ammo. Its done better at times but avg's 3/4 MOA

My War Sport 18" L gets right at 2 MOA with a AimPoint Micro 4 MOA dot with XM193 and M855 ammo. When I replace the AimPoint and run a 6x optic I get right at 1 MOA.

Next week I am stretching out the War Sport LVOA and will post its abilitys at distance. We are shooting 100yds to 500yds and will see how it does.

Below are some pics of the MK12MOD2L with a March 1-10x24mm @ 600yds

[IMG]http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y117/RED68C/DSCI0207.jpg[/IMG]
The rifle

[IMG]http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y117/RED68C/DSCI0204-1.jpg[/IMG]
Fat part 12" wide Shot group of 4 a little left @ 600yds then I went for head shots x2 one in the head, one in the neck.

John

[gregintenn]

[quote]You just always hear people talk about how accurate AR's are,guess I'm expecting too much.
[/quote]

A lot of that is talk. I prefer to see an actual group shot before putting much stock in talk. Try some different loads; perhaps with lighter bullets. You'l likely find one your gun really likes with enough luck and/or dilligence.

[Guest J.boyette]

[quote name='jeff43' timestamp='1353899151' post='850678']
I've shot Wolf,WPA steel cased through mine.It's fairly accurate,but sticks in the chamber when it gets hot.I don't know how many rds. mine has had through it,the bore looks great though.As far as accuracy I guess I'm just used to bolt gun accuracy.You just always hear people talk about how accurate AR's are,guess I'm expecting too much.
Jeff
[/quote]

Jeff,

The Bushmaster you have is a 1/9 twist. You would do well with 52 / 53 grn match loads. 69 is at the high end of bullet weight for a 1/9.

Now alot of it comes to recoil managment and trigger control. A good quality trigger will improve a AR-15 by leaps and bounds. Also learning trigger reset, proper cheek weld and all that stuff is more in play then on a manual operated rifle.

A manual operated rifle is EASY to shoot well, a semi-auto takes skill.

Let me know if I can help you any.

John

[PoofNoEyeBrows]

100 yards with a RRA 6.8 coyote upper.

[img]http://i1281.photobucket.com/albums/a516/kmoltzan/IMG_0048.jpg[/img]

[Djay3]

My ban era Colt 20" Hbar 1/9 (no flash hider) non-floated barrel is capable of 1.5 moa. Not exceptional but acceptable for my standards.

I cobbled together a Sabre Defence 16" 1/7 twist floated upper c flash hider with a LMT lower c 2 stage trigger. Using Hornady .62 gr TAP it has recorded 1 moa! This specific Sabre barrel is chrome lined yet exceptional in my opinion.

In good stable weather conditions and a quality brand AR barrel's favorite commercial load, I suspect 100 yard groups of 1.5" to 2" 5 shot groups are fairly representative using a good stable bench setup. For small group shooting a quality stainless non-lined AR barrel might prove more accurate in general.

For tiny sub moa groups something like a nice bolt action CZ American would be the ticket. Apples to Oranges of course. : )

[DaveTN]

What optics is on your Savage and Stevens vs. your AR. “Grouping” has everything to do with the shooters ability to repeat POA.

[graycrait]

Damn! I just traded my Sig X-Five Tactical for a 20" pre-Freedom Group Bushmaster Hbar that is the easiest shooting AR I have ever shot. I am modding the gun a bit more to see how it will shoot with a 24X Mildot scope. Now you folks have me searching for a better barrel and certainly a better trigger. Then like a darn .22LR I need to match brand, charge, shape, etc. of bullet to the barrel. Chasing accuracy in any rifle is somewhat maddening, probably somewhat of a waste of time and resources in practical terms, but challenging.

[trevorst]

My RRA predator pursuit will put lake city 1" all day. Best groups have came with 69gr smk hand loads and have shot multiple groups in the .2-.3" range. Will oddly enough place 52gr amax sub .5 moa also...

My predator pursuit was custom ordered 18" stainless bead blasted 1/8 twist. Geissele national match trigger helped immensely with group size.

[jeff43]

[quote name='DaveTN' timestamp='1354485697' post='853909']
What optics is on your Savage and Stevens vs. your AR. “Grouping” has everything to do with the shooters ability to repeat POA.
[/quote]
Savage has a Nikon 4.5x14x40 Buckmaster,Stevens is a Simmons Whitetail hunter 6x18x42 I think without getting it out of the safe.AR has a Nikon Prostaff 3x9x40.
Jeff Edited December 5, 2012 by jeff43

[sybo]

My Sabre Defence Competition Deluxe with my reloads.30 pretty consistant.I'll not sell this one!