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Ladyhay

Can I ask a momma question? Coupled with a what gun/will this gun work ?

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So, I am very very new to all this, and in researching ammo for a SW Mod 38 that was given to me (revolver 5 shot, J frame, .38 SPL) I have come up with even more questions.

 

So mama's (and whomever) just hang with me, as I am overwhelmed, and all over the place, I know.  We all leave after Christmas to travel with my husband on business, but when I come home, I am coming home alone.  He will be back here or there for a week or two at a time until June. So I feel like I need to figure this all out, practice my butt off and be ready- if nothing else just to sleep better. 

 

So issue numero uno on my radar:

    Assuming someone broke into our home, and was in my children's joint bedroom, I am afraid I would not fire for fear of hitting a child.  I don't mean for poor aim, not that, but the way the room is configured it would be door, them, a bed (one of two). If I shot intruder, is there a way to ensure the bullet would remain in them, and not travel any further?  I don't want it going through them and hitting my child. I could move their beds, I could, but it really disturbs sleep.  But that may be the only option and I am open to that so as to not worry.

 

I am going to the gun shop today, was supposed to go earlier, but got a bit delayed.  

 

Going in with issue number one, I am (trying) to develop criteria for my weapon+ammo:  If my Mod 38 fits it, great, if not- as much as I really love so much about this family gun (have not fired it yet) I would move on, and dear granny would be okay with that ;)

 

 

Ammo available that won't travel through a person.

Recoil limited to allow me to shoot for practice with enjoyment and again if needed.

It will stop a crackhead/meth head/heroine etc.

I can fire it accurately with practice. 

Concealable, I am not that small framed but my clothes fit well, I run, the J frame conceals almost completely but *I* can see it.

May or may not add to this list a laser.

I have rheumatoid arthritis. I cannot rack my husbands Glock 17, 9mm(well mine, idk, he bought it for me, I disliked it), I couldn't even load the magazine with the helper piece fully.  My hands are not incapacitated during a flare, but they are very stiff and do not move in certain ways on occasion. I wanted a revolver for this reason.

It has to meet all of these criteria at the same time.

 

If y'all got this far, 

THANKS!

 

 

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It sounds like y'all might have some things concerning you that needs pursuing outside of weapon selection.

 

That said, the rules of firearm handing still apply - even in the house.  Namely, "never point a weapon at something you're not willing to destroy" and "always be sure of your target and what's beyond your target."  As the father of three, my wife and I used to have the same concerns.  The only way we were really able to get past them was to move to a house where the children were on another level from the main portion of the house.  When considering shooting inside a home, you need to be aware of not only where an intruder is, but also where everyone else is, too.

 

I carry a J-frame like yours every day.  But, inside my home I use something else.  From my perspective, capacity is limited to 5 rounds and reloads are notoriously slow.  The Glock is probably as easy to rack as any modern handgun out there, so if that's an issue you might have to compromise a bit.  A shotgun is a good defensive weapon and may suit your needs.

 

How old are your kids, and would it be possible to barricade yourself in with them if need be?

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LadyHay, welcome, we're glad you are here and glad you are asking questions!  You are on your way to being empowered to protect yourself and your loved ones.

 

     A lot of good folks on here may say it better than I, but here's a start.  You are doing a good thing - while you continue down this path, be assertive, figure out what works for you, and train safety, train competence, train awareness - until it becomes second nature.  

 

1st:  You (me, or anyone else with good sense) are not going to fire an SW38 snubnose with an innocent or loved one anywhere downrange of the muzzle.  Especially not in the heat of the moment, in the dark.  Repeat:  You will not be taking out a bad-guy who is standing 3 feet to the side of your kid with a snubnose 38 - much less if he is closer to your children .. or in line with them.  A good way to think about this is to get to a range where you can (after becoming competent in the operation of your firearm):  safely work from the holster... or have the firearm loaded (1 round only!) on a table. now - do as many pushups as you can until you fail... get up and pick up the revolver (maintaining safe muzzle discipline - always downrange), quickly fire a round into a man-sized target at 10 feet.  Now picture doing that in the dark when you are scared witless.

     Also - assume the bullet WILL exit your intended target... and train to acquire angles of fire give which you a safe backstop.  If there is a round that has no risk of penetrating an assailant, then it will probably be less than adequate to stop said assailant.  **Planning how to defend your home is more important than what firearm (tool) you employ to carry out that plan.  Denying any assailant easy entry to your home and identifying smart, safe places to defend from are key.  

     If you are separated from others in the house and do not have one key pinchpoint to defend, then you might benefit from a plan for each area to defend their pinchpoint (safe lines of fire!!!) and be able to communicate (walkie talkies?).  Otherwise - when you move around in your house - you give up a distinct advantage.. and when your life is on the line, you want every advantage you can get.

 

2nd:  Do you already know the 4 gun laws?  If not, that's ok.  Learn them by heart, and live by them without exception.  It is not elementary, it is essential.

 

3rd: Light, light, light.  Whatever you do, you need to be proficient handling a firearm and a light.. or a firearm with a light attached to it.  You always want to be able to identify your target!!!!  Just say no to friendly fire!

 

4th: Firearm selection.  That snubnose 38 is not the best thing to begin with if you can afford different.  You might look at a full-size striker-fired handgun like a S&W M&P or a Glock or an XD.  You may choose 9mm, as some find .40 to snappy.  I would choose .40 or .45.  I would then mount a light on it so that you can dedicate both hands to your grip.   If the 38 is all you can do right now, that's just fine - plan and train accordingly!

 

5th: Ask around for a well-respected handgun class and sign up, and take it!!   In a life and death situation, you will be scared of the assailant, but you can train out fear of and ingrain respect for your firearm of choice.

 

Thank you for asking.. .. oh, and thanks David and staff for providing a place where these questions can be asked!!!!

Edited by Peace

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As MacGyver noted (and stated quite well), firearm/ammo selection is only part of your concerns.  I know time is limited here, but one-on-one professional guidance would seem to be helpful -- from someone who deals with this from a professional point -- and yes, there is ammunition that is *designed* for your scenario (entering but not exiting).  And while "more is (usually) better," a 5-shot revolver that you are comfortable with -- and proficient with -- trumps most anything else that you are NOT comfortable or proficient with.  So again, professional guidance -- someone on the forum who has more knowledge than I do can probably help out with that.

 

Another consideration -- security system for the home; NOT an "alarm," but a security system.  Dralarms can weigh in on that issue much better than I can, but I wouldn't do without mine.  A good system won't keep someone out (and neither will deadbolts, etc.) but it WILL alert you that an attempt is/has been made to enter your home.  Provides my family with a good deal of piece of mind, both while we are at home and while we are away.

 

Other questions you asked: Recoil: yes, there is ammo on the market with reduced recoil -- but in my experience, it helps to practice with what you are going to use;

Stopping power: 'Pert near any ammo or caliber will stop someone if shot is properly placed (including the lowly .22 -- but I wouldn't recommend it for a defensive round)

Accuracy: The old adage that "practice makes perfect" applies here -- I once had a Walther that I couldn't hit the broad side of a barn with, even with practice; so try that .38 before you bet your life on it, although it's a good platform and a good round.

Concealment: Depends on how you wear it -- but don't scrimp on a good holster, however you choose to carry it.

Laser: My wife loves hers (also on a .38 snubbie -- S&W J-frame 637).  I wouldn't give a quarter for one, on the other hand.

 

Best wishes, and good luck.  Hopefully others will weigh in with more and better info than I have.

 

J.

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The problem with ammo that is suitable for killing people is that it is going to go through things.  Look up frangible ammo, and you will see ONE solution to your issue.   But even then, if you miss, it WILL probably go thru a paper thin interior door (mostly hollow) with enough energy to be of concern. 

 

You can train yourself to shoot up or down, maybe --- that is, angle your gun so that 10 feet behind the bad guy, it is hitting at shoe level, but such shooting is awkward.  Or you can do the reverse, if you are in good health and crouch down, shooting at a high angle so at 10 feet past the bad guy, the round is too high to be a threat.  While this sort of thing works, it is an extra burden for a new shooter AND it is frowned upon to be shooting the ceiling or floor at the range.... so you may not be able to practice it with live ammo depending on your access to good shooting places. 

 

A light 38 JHP, IFF it expands properly, will dump a LOT of its energy into a bad guy, but missing, its deadly if it hits someone behind.  Basically its a weakish round to begin with, and if you had a light load, and it expands, it will slow down (bigger things take more energy to punch through, surface area etc) so that has merits.

 

If your kids are old enough, you can try to make a drill for them (get under the bed, run to their attached bathroom, or closet, or something).

 

You could reinforce their room, put in a steel security door and reinforce the walls to stop a bullet.

 

But the cheapest, easiest, and safest thing to do would be to get the kids OUT of the line of fire.  Period.  Everything else is a bandaid that MAY work (bulletproof walls will work for sure, at some expense).

 

 

Ammo available that won't travel through a person.  --- possible, but see above, if you miss, it still hurts the kids...

 

Recoil limited to allow me to shoot for practice with enjoyment and again if needed.   --- OK, you should buy practice ammo for practice and defense ammo for defense.

 

It will stop a crackhead/meth head/heroine etc.  --- to stop a person who feels NO pain, you must stop their heart or brain from working.  This can be done with a .22 if you can hit your target.   A golf ball sized hole in their kidneys will kill them if the medic does not arrive swiftly but he can still kill YOU in the meantime.

 

I can fire it accurately with practice.  --- practice ammo solves this too.  

 

Concealable, I am not that small framed but my clothes fit well, I run, the J frame conceals almost completely but *I* can see it.  --- there are tons of small pistols.  If yours works for you, use it.

 

 

May or may not add to this list a laser --- most guns support a laser, if not, a GOOD gunsmith can attach one anyway.

 

.

I have rheumatoid arthritis. I cannot rack my husbands Glock 17, 9mm(well mine, idk, he bought it for me, I disliked it), I couldn't even load the magazine with the helper piece fully.  My hands are not incapacitated during a flare, but they are very stiff and do not move in certain ways on occasion. I wanted a revolver for this reason.

It has to meet all of these criteria at the same time.   ---- Again, let me strongly recommend a spring job to make the gun easy to use, it will greatly reduce the trigger pull force.

 

ALL that can be done.  However, choose your practice ammo off 2 things: easy to shoot/light load and the price tag (cheap ammo means more practice).  If you have a lot of spare time, consider reloading your own if you want to shoot a LOT.   Or, alternatively, consider a similar J frame .22 pistol for practice with cheap ammo: it will pay for itself in about a year of heavy use or a few years of light use.    Choose your self defense ammo more carefully, and buy enough to SHOOT some of it as well as have enough for a loaded gun and a couple of reloads.  Usually, that means about 2 boxes of it.  

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It sounds like y'all might have some things concerning you that needs pursuing outside of weapon selection.

 

That said, the rules of firearm handing still apply - even in the house.  Namely, "never point a weapon at something you're not willing to destroy" and "always be sure of your target and what's beyond your target."  As the father of three, my wife and I used to have the same concerns.  The only way we were really able to get past them was to move to a house where the children were on another level from the main portion of the house.  When considering shooting inside a home, you need to be aware of not only where an intruder is, but also where everyone else is, too.

 

I carry a J-frame like yours every day.  But, inside my home I use something else.  From my perspective, capacity is limited to 5 rounds and reloads are notoriously slow.  The Glock is probably as easy to rack as any modern handgun out there, so if that's an issue you might have to compromise a bit.  A shotgun is a good defensive weapon and may suit your needs.

 

How old are your kids, and would it be possible to barricade yourself in with them if need be?

My children are three and four.  I have thought about how to do this effectively, and I do not see how.  I think we could escape to the roof and down the ladder but not barricade in anywhere on the main level.  We have one room in the basement that has no windows, and a steel door.

 

I am glad to know that I am not the only one that has had these concerns. 

 

I have lots of shotguns :) I thought they would be worse for some reason.  But I have a few 12g's and a few 20g's, that I inherited from my grandfather.  I just laughed out loud, like literally, everyone leaves us their firearms.  I just realized that! 

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I am off to the gun shop now. 

 

Hopefully they will recommend someone who can give lessons or gives classes. 

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Shotguns have a lot of merits.   You can use all kinds of ammo, they pack a major amount of stopping power, its EXTREMELY difficult for a 3 year old to shoot themself with one (gun is taller than they are, probably).   They have all kinds of problems too (big, difficult to manuver in some homes,  massive recoil that some shooters cannot handle,  some ammo types will go thru an exterior wall let alone interior stuff) and more.   Its a choice and a good one, but its not "better" its "different".

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Ladyhay, you are in need of some training, I know I am a bit late, ask at the gun shop.

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In regards to the limited capacity of the revolver:  you can always have your husband leave the Glock loaded for you (round chambered) and keep that in addition to the revolver.  Then you could use whichever one you are most comfortable with, and use the other one for a  "New York Reload" (using a back-up gun instead of actual reload).

 

When my wife and I first started considering her carrying a gun, she had a lot of difficulty racking the slide of a LC9.  We considered just having me load it for her, and then all she would have to do was pull the trigger.  Eventually she just learned to rack the slide in a different way; there's a video (on You Tube) for women that presents a different way to rack the slide that made it easier.

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I have given this some thought and I have been in your same conditions back when my children were young like 4 and 5 and believe it or not they are more resilient than most people give them credit for. My two boys ran through one simple drill which was practiced about twice a month and by the 3rd drill it was smooth as a Rolex watch. My code word that I used was scatter and at that point with in a few seconds my boys were both under their beds and not making a sound. I told them in the beginning we were going to play a little game and then once we got it fine tuned I told them that I was doing this to keep everyone safe and they were quite up to learning it well. Now they are grown and gone but I still worry about the same thing you do and that is where my bullet may end up if I shoot someone and have a threw and threw. I fixed that issue just recently. I shoot 380 caliper semi autos and I purchased a bullet called a Hydrashok made by Federal Ammo company for my 380's. It is a low recoil round that hits with a great impact and serious knock down power but will not exit the person shot for the most part. One of my main reasons for choosing the Bersa Thunder 380 caliper is it is a double action gun on first round and then goes semi auto after that and you can have back up magazines loaded and just the push of a button and your reloaded and slamming the action back to do more business. The only time you have to rack the action is to chamber your first round and from then on you just keep shooting as long as you have magazines preloaded.  Might not be something you want to do right this minute but might be something to look at down the road. You got a lot of great advice from folks here a lot of more knowledgeable than myself but wanted to give you something to think about for maybe a time in your future when your looking at new hand guns.  

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Ladyhay, you are in need of some training, I know I am a bit late, ask at the gun shop.


Don't worry guys, I know.

And I am quite an over --some word that is failing me--- in regards to things of any serious nature. I will annoy myself with all aspects of this before I ever load a weapon.

I realize it's backwards but I really read the owners manual to a new car before driving it. It's as insane as it comes, and nursing school was sometimes a riot, but I *have* to know about things before I proceed. It is how my brain works.

And at this point in the knowledge undertaking I may never carry, various reasons, but a lot of fear involved.

I will post more later, long day, and no help with the one on one from the gun shops, although they were very kind.

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Wish you were closer, I could recommend a good teacher.

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You've got a good process going on... you'll get there.

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Don't worry guys, I know.
And I am quite an over --some word that is failing me--- in regards to things of any serious nature. I will annoy myself with all aspects of this before I ever load a weapon.
I realize it's backwards but I really read the owners manual to a new car before driving it. It's as insane as it comes, and nursing school was sometimes a riot, but I *have* to know about things before I proceed. It is how my brain works.
And at this point in the knowledge undertaking I may never carry, various reasons, but a lot of fear involved.
I will post more later, long day, and no help with the one on one from the gun shops, although they were very kind.


Sounds like you've got your head right on the matter and capable of making the right choices for your family. The fact that your actively seeking information bodes very well.

To throw my two cents in, I would stop feeling overly anxious about your upcoming trip as though it were some kind of big deadline. You'll set yourself up for failure, what your talking about is an involved, lengthy process. At least it should be.

I might have missed this earlier, but do you have any trigger time on either pistols? If not I would practice safe operation (firing) them both and see if you have a preference to one over the other once you take loading out of the equation for the Glock.

If you like the revolver best, then fine. Continue to get as much practice as time and money allow before your trip. Buy a speed loader to have a ready reload handy, and keep your loaded revolver at home in the bedroom. Once you get home for the day keep it on you if you wish, or keep it in the room, whatever feels right. Whenever you find the chance for some good training, get some.


And remember, the odds are astronomically huge that you will NEVER NEED your weapon, which is not to say you should not be prepared, and vigilant, more to hopefully ease some of the nerves your feeling about the whole thing.

Also number 1 most important, you can't be afraid of your gun. Respectful, absolutely. But afraid? No.

Try carrying your gun around the house with you unloaded as much as possible. Familiarize yourself self with it and you'll be much more comfortable. You need to reprogram your brain to think if it not so much as "a gun" and more so as a tool. A very deadly, very specific tool, but no different at the end if the day than a hammer.



Also your kids are about the perfect age to start reinforcing gun safety.
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Also wanted to throw out there that if you prefer the revolvers operation but have a hard time with accuracy a longer barreled model might be a better choice.

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Look, there is absolutely nothing wrong with a .38 snub revolver for home defense.  Nothing.  One more time: NOTHING.  During an average self-defense shooting, the person fires a whopping two shots (my memory is saying it was actually 1.8 or something like that, but I don't recall the source).  In one study of police shootings, the average number of shots fired is less than 5 and that's with them carrying semi-auto handguns with high-cap mags.  Cops carried .38 revolvers for decades and killed plenty of people in the process, and usually with lead round nose or FMJ bullets instead of hollow-points.

Putting this all in proper perspective, you need to think of a few key points:

 

1) The likelihood of you ever needing to use any firearm in self-defense is extremely small.  Violent crime stats show you are much safer today than 20 years ago.

2) Even if you do find an intruder in your home, it's very unlikely that they will head to your kids' room.  They want your money, valuables, etc.

3) Even if the intruder does go to your kids' room, they are very likely to flee when they encounter a very upset mother armed with a handgun.

4) That revolver has more than enough capacity and firepower to stop a threat as long as you do your part.

5) Because the firearm - any firearm - is only as good as the person using it, make sure that it is in proper working condition and you know how to shoot it well.

6) If you don't feel confident with your shooting skills, you need to get some training and practice.  

7) If you still aren't comfortable, you may want to consider adding a baseball bat to your arsenal.  Getting clocked on the head is usually a threat stopper.

8) Keep a flashlight available so you can easily see what you are potentially pointing your firearm at.

9) In reference to the comment about a security system, even the illusion of a security system, such as alarm stickers or a sign outside is good enough.

10) If you don't have a dog, and don't want to get a dog, make it look like you have a dog.  A "BEWARE OF DOG" signs and a big chew toy in the yard is good enough.

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If the children are young enough and were willing I would put their bed in your room or a metress on the floor for when it is just you and the kids. That way you can all be in the same room if something were to happen. Then just sit tight with your weapon at the ready while the children get under the bed or in a closet. If you don't have problems with the kids getting up in the night and roaming the house a simple $20 battery opperated motion detector in the main part of your house works well. Or a dog... I like to think preventive measures too. And another thing, I don't know your husbands means of travel but if possible leave his vehicle oitside or borrow a spare from a relative and park it outside to look as if there are multiple people home. Out of the two guns you listed the Glock id definitely better for home defense in my opinion as long as you can rack the slide. And as mentioned above, a good light and maybe even a 33 round mag for your 17.

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I can't second the shotgun advice enough.  No need to get all tactical and get something you don't really need, one of the ones you have lying around may work.  A pump action in 20 or 12 gauge with a wooden stock and a 18-20" barrell is perfect.  Heavy enough to absorb recoil, but short enough to maneuver around tigt spaces.  I like shotguns because of their versatility.  You can load with birdshot, buckshot, or slugs.  I'll probably get laughed at but I like birdshot for in home defense, it is super deadly at 3-5 yards (come on how for are you really going to be shooting indoors?)  Yet at the same time it's not hardly going to penetrate walls and if it does the likelyhood of it having enough energy to seriously harm someone on the other side of the wall is slim.  

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Something that hasn't been covered. It sounds like your kids room is on the first floor. If you own your home I'd recommend planting a rose (or some other prickly type) bush beneath their bedroom window. Thugs won't enter or hide there.

 

The alarm system is another good idea, it doesn't need to be 'monitored' by a company, just make noise and maybe turn on a light.

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This is something I forgot to mention and I don't think anyone else mentioned it but I just did this a couple days ago and I didn't do it because I don't feel secure because I am a good shot with any of my weapons. I did it in hopes of never needing to actually use them. I have motion sensor lighting put on my out side of m home. It now lights up all sides of my home and only cost about $150.00 and I think is was a very good investment. A bad guy depends a lot of the cover of darkness and when that is taken away from him or them they will flee in most cases , I would say 95% of the time flee the area to get out of the light. In the light they are a clear and present target...............jmho

Edited by bersaguy
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This is something I forgot to mention and I don't think anyone else mentioned it but I just did this a couple days ago and I didn't do it because I don't feel secure because I am a good shot with any of my weapons. I did it in hopes of never needing to actually use them. I have motion sensor lighting put on my out side of m home. It now lights up all sides of my home and only cost about $150.00 and I think is was a very good investment. A bad guy depends a lot of the cover of darkness and when that is taken away from him or them they will flee in most cases , I would say 95% of the time flee the area to get out of the light. In the light they are a clear and present target...............jmho


Good advice on illuminating the area from Bersaguy. Additionally I like the idea of rose bushes outside of windows.

Ladyhay, I had a thought this morning, have you tried going down to the local PD station and asking for training recommendations? Odds are high that whoever is in charge of officer training also works with civilians. You may or may not get a bit of resistance from the desk officer ("buy a dog", buy a baseball bat", "call us") but if you are polite yet firm that you have decided your course of action, you will most likely walk away with some good info.

The majority of police officers I've dealt with (and with one former, one retired, and one active in the family that's been more than a few) are very pro gun and want people to be able to defend themselves. A minority are not and will try to bully you into thinking that being able to safely defend yourself is beyond you. "A bad guy might take it away and use on you" "your opening yourself up to lawsuits" etc.

Odds are your interaction will be a smooth, positive one. Don't be discouraged if its not though.

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I just went out and checked my sensor reaching and I had to adjust both of them because they were coming on two close to the house and I wanted to to reach out farther. Now I went and tested them again and they will now turn on when anyone gets with in about 40 feet of the house which is perfect for me. I don't want that at my door before the lights come on. I do want to give them a chance to run before they are trying to out run incoming hot lead. I had to laugh when neighbor in Duplex came home a few minutes ago. Our carports are right next to each other and it scare her as she began to walk towards the house and the lights came on all at once. I asked her if she wanted me to adjust them so she did not trigger them on her walk from her car to her door and she said no and appreciated the lights and now she does not have to walk between her car and house in the dark any more.

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