Talked about before!!!!

[BigK]

Just now, deerslayer said:

 

I completely agree - why lower your odds with a mouse gun?

Life is a series of compromises, right? If lowering your odds w/ a mouse gun is unacceptable for the sake of convenience, so is carrying a pistol instead of a shotgun or rifle.

[gregintenn]

I assume everyone here realizes a 380 ACP projectile and a 9mm Mauser projectile make the exact same diameter hole, right?

[TGO David]

43 minutes ago, gregintenn said:

I assume everyone here realizes a 380 ACP projectile and a 9mm Mauser projectile make the exact same diameter hole, right?

.22 Long Rifle and 5.56 make the same size hole as one another also.

[papa61]

1 hour ago, deerslayer said:

 

I completely agree - why lower your odds with a mouse gun?

I don't.
odds I'm carrying my "mouse gun" 99.99% - odds I'm carrying ANYTHING else 50/50
odds I will hit a vital area 99%
odds I'm using quality hollow point 100%
odds I'm carrying the one 9mm I own slim

I won't debate caliber effectiveness. I agree with @gregintenn if I expected to be in a gunfight I wouldn't carry a pistol. I'd remove myself from the scenario completely unless it was my home. And 380 ACP, 38spl, 357mag, 9mm, and 38 super all make the same hole with FMJ or LRN bullets. 

[papa61]

13 minutes ago, TGO David said:

.22 Long Rifle and 5.56 make the same size hole as one another also.

I have read that the first S&W rimfire revolver was quite popular with civil war soldiers who could get one. War would be the only place I would choose round count over concealability or a "better" caliber. 

[Grayfox54]

2 hours ago, deerslayer said:

 

I completely agree - why lower your odds with a mouse gun?

Because sometimes a mouse gun is the best for the circumstances. Sure, we'd all like to constantly carry a full size, major caliber gun all the time. But sometimes, it just ain't practical. 

For most of my adult life my EDC was a Colt Commander in .45acp. I've gotten old and my health ain't so good anymore. These days I find that a small frame, 5 shot .38 is much more practical for my everyday life style.  And sometimes, for like a quick trip to the store, just dropping a little .25 auto in my pocket is fine with me. 

[chances R]

1 hour ago, Grayfox54 said:

Because sometimes a mouse gun is the best for the circumstances. Sure, we'd all like to constantly carry a full size, major caliber gun all the time. But sometimes, it just ain't practical. 

For most of my adult life my EDC was a Colt Commander in .45acp. I've gotten old and my health ain't so good anymore. These days I find that a small frame, 5 shot .38 is much more practical for my everyday life style.  And sometimes, for like a quick trip to the store, just dropping a little .25 auto in my pocket is fine with me. 

and sometimes it is just an inconvience to go 'heavy' strapped, a quick pocket gun is better than no gun at all.

[gregintenn]

2 hours ago, TGO David said:

.22 Long Rifle and 5.56 make the same size hole as one another also.

And either would likely be better for fighting than the average handgun.

[deerslayer]

2 hours ago, papa61 said:

I don't.
odds I'm carrying my "mouse gun" 99.99% - odds I'm carrying ANYTHING else 50/50
odds I will hit a vital area 99%

I can't imagine a scenario where I can carry a mouse gun, but can't carry a small 9mm auto, BUT you'll never see me in the store wearing pajamas, swimming trunks, or jogging pants.  I think mouse guns can gradually erode basic carry discipline.  

 

2 hours ago, papa61 said:

And 380 ACP, 38spl, 357mag, 9mm, and 38 super all make the same hole with FMJ or LRN bullets. 

I don't know anyone who carries FMJ or LRN.  

[deerslayer]

2 hours ago, Grayfox54 said:

Because sometimes a mouse gun is the best for the circumstances. Sure, we'd all like to constantly carry a full size, major caliber gun all the time. But sometimes, it just ain't practical. 

For most of my adult life my EDC was a Colt Commander in .45acp. I've gotten old and my health ain't so good anymore. These days I find that a small frame, 5 shot .38 is much more practical for my everyday life style.  And sometimes, for like a quick trip to the store, just dropping a little .25 auto in my pocket is fine with me. 

I don't remember the last time I carried a "full size" gun; it's rarely necessary.  

[gregintenn]

3 minutes ago, deerslayer said:

 

 

I don't know anyone who carries FMJ or LRN.  

I do. Flat point FMJ.

[deerslayer]

36 minutes ago, chances R said:

and sometimes it is just an inconvience to go 'heavy' strapped, a quick pocket gun is better than no gun at all.

I agree, but nowadays, it's just about as easy to throw a small 9mm in the pocket as it is various .380s, .32s, .25s, etc.  

[deerslayer]

26 minutes ago, gregintenn said:

I do. Flat point FMJ.

I will pray for you my brother 

[Kywldcts]

.380 probably shouldn’t be your #1 choice given the availability of something more powerful and the ability to dress properly to conceal it, but that isn’t always how life works.  You cannot (or at least should not) base your life, all of your clothes, or your entire personality and existence around concealed carry.  I had never carried anything smaller than 9mm until I got my S&W Bodyguard 2.0 and it really changed my perspective.  
 

I wanted to be able to go on walks and carry and I wanted to wear sweatpants or gym shorts while I did it…and I wanted something that could be put in my pocket or clipped beltless than wasn’t a burden and didn’t weight down my pants.  I bought the Bodyguard 2.0 and fell in love with it…small and light, but still fits my hand well and can actually be aimed and shot comfortably.  Comparable sized 9mm (like the P365 or Hellcat) are still bigger, double the weight, and, while not unbearable, aren’t exactly fun to shoot in any way.  And something like the 442/642 is thicker, heavier, shorter barrel but bigger, awful “sights”, awful trigger, and 5 rounds.  
 

Like someone else said, it’s about trade offs.  A small .380 or a LCR in .22lr loaded with Federal Punch is better in your pocket while you run down to Shell to get gas for your lawn mower than your Glock 19 at home on your dresser because you’re in gym shorts.  Or even if you have on jeans and a belt and just want to go eat dinner being comfortable 16 ounces is always going to be more comfortable than 30+.  Some people want to carry the biggest gun they can all the time with extra mags and that’s fine, but if you go with odds and practicality you’re never, ever, ever going to pull or use your gun in self defense and even if you do the threat is not going to be expecting rounds coming at him at all.  Whatever you have in you should be adequate.  And this doesn’t even go into discussions about people who have trouble shooting larger calibers or maybe don’t have the strength to chamber a semi-auto round.  If all you can load and shoot well is a .22lr than get something reliable, load it with good ammo, and carry it proudly.  

[leroy]

22 hours ago, gregintenn said:

I do. Flat point FMJ.

I'm old enough to rmwmber when this wuz cutting edge for 9mm, 38 super, n 45acp... Still got several hundred rounds of Hornady flat points in these calibers in the loading room and probably 700 or so hot loaded 9 mm.

As I remember. none other than the USAF Nuclear Protection bunch pioneered these in 9mm... Cutting edge, early 80s, known by old time revolver men for ages as a swc...

leroy.

[deerslayer]

4 hours ago, Kywldcts said:

.380 probably shouldn’t be your #1 choice given the availability of something more powerful and the ability to dress properly to conceal it, but that isn’t always how life works.  You cannot (or at least should not) base your life, all of your clothes, or your entire personality and existence around concealed carry.  I had never carried anything smaller than 9mm until I got my S&W Bodyguard 2.0 and it really changed my perspective.  
 

I wanted to be able to go on walks and carry and I wanted to wear sweatpants or gym shorts while I did it…and I wanted something that could be put in my pocket or clipped beltless than wasn’t a burden and didn’t weight down my pants.  I bought the Bodyguard 2.0 and fell in love with it…small and light, but still fits my hand well and can actually be aimed and shot comfortably.  Comparable sized 9mm (like the P365 or Hellcat) are still bigger, double the weight, and, while not unbearable, aren’t exactly fun to shoot in any way.  And something like the 442/642 is thicker, heavier, shorter barrel but bigger, awful “sights”, awful trigger, and 5 rounds.  
 

Like someone else said, it’s about trade offs.  A small .380 or a LCR in .22lr loaded with Federal Punch is better in your pocket while you run down to Shell to get gas for your lawn mower than your Glock 19 at home on your dresser because you’re in gym shorts.  Or even if you have on jeans and a belt and just want to go eat dinner being comfortable 16 ounces is always going to be more comfortable than 30+.  Some people want to carry the biggest gun they can all the time with extra mags and that’s fine, but if you go with odds and practicality you’re never, ever, ever going to pull or use your gun in self defense and even if you do the threat is not going to be expecting rounds coming at him at all.  Whatever you have in you should be adequate.  And this doesn’t even go into discussions about people who have trouble shooting larger calibers or maybe don’t have the strength to chamber a semi-auto round.  If all you can load and shoot well is a .22lr than get something reliable, load it with good ammo, and carry it proudly.  

I guess I just live a different lifestyle from some.  Good example - earlier today I found some evidence in my storage building out back that made me take a sudden trip to the store to get some mouse traps.  I was wearing simple running shorts because I had planned to just piddle around the house all day.  Keys, wallet, two phones (I'm on call at work), and a pocket knife later, the running shorts were out the window before a carry gun was even a consideration.  Two minutes later, I was out the door with the above mentioned necessities plus a Sig 365 Fuse in an IWB holster under my t-shirt (a legit fighting pistol IMO, but hardly full size), all riding in a pair of light duty cargo shorts (my standard attire nine months a year anyway).  I guess a standard 365, Glock 43, or even a j-frame in my front pocket would have also sufficed, but a smaller .380 or .25 was pointless.  I don't dress like a tier 1 bearded go-fast bro, but I still never find myself in a situation where a 9 ounce BB gun is all that will work.  

Edited 7 hours ago by deerslayer

[gregintenn]

16 minutes ago, deerslayer said:

I guess I just live a different lifestyle from some.  Good example - earlier today I found some evidence in my storage building out back that made me take a sudden trip to the store to get some mouse traps.  I was wearing simple running shorts because I had planned to just piddle around the house all day.  Keys, wallet, two phones (I'm on call at work), and a pocket knife later, the running shorts were out the window before a carry gun was even a consideration.  Two minutes later, I was out the door with the above mentioned necessities plus a Sig 365 Fuse in an IWB holster under my t-shirt (a legit fighting pistol IMO, but hardly full size), all riding in a pair of light duty cargo shorts (my standard attire nine months a year anyway).  I guess a standard 365, Glock 43, or even a j-frame in my front pocket would have also sufficed, but a smaller .380 or .25 was pointless.  I don't dress like a tier 1 bearded go-fast bro, but I still never find myself in a situation where a 9 ounce BB gun is all that will work.  

Well, we don’t all live in Memphis.

[Moped]

A small .380 or even .32ACP has a place. I usually have LCP Max in a DeSantis Nemesis in my pocket on the way out the door. But I also have. Glock 21 in my back pack. But the little .380 is in my pocket a lot of the time. Sometimes it’s a 442 on the hip, but two weeks ago I traded into a like new Glock 26/5 MOS. I carried it on vacation most of the week last week.

Doubt I’ll go smaller than the 26. I have a ton of Glock 17 round 9mm mags. Don’t see the point in going with a 43 or a SIG 365. Probably going to trade my Ruger Max9 soon. I like the Glock better. But this is my 4th Glock, I currently own, so I guess you could call e a fan boy at this point.

[deerslayer]

22 minutes ago, gregintenn said:

Well, we don’t all live in Memphis.

I didn't go within 20 miles of that place, but you never know when one might breach the wire.  

[deerslayer]

23 minutes ago, Moped said:

A small .380 or even .32ACP has a place. I usually have LCP Max in a DeSantis Nemesis in my pocket on the way out the door. But I also have. Glock 21 in my back pack. But the little .380 is in my pocket a lot of the time. Sometimes it’s a 442 on the hip, but two weeks ago I traded into a like new Glock 26/5 MOS. I carried it on vacation most of the week last week.

Doubt I’ll go smaller than the 26. I have a ton of Glock 17 round 9mm mags. Don’t see the point in going with a 43 or a SIG 365. Probably going to trade my Ruger Max9 soon. I like the Glock better. But this is my 4th Glock, I currently own, so I guess you could call e a fan boy at this point.

I have a friend who pocket carries (and conceals) a 26 with a red dot.  I'm 5'10/190 and could never pull that off, but he is more the offensive line type.  

[BigK]

2 minutes ago, deerslayer said:

I have a friend who pocket carries (and conceals) a 26 with a red dot.  I'm 5'10/190 and could never pull that off, but he is more the offensive line type.  

I used to pocket carry a Ruger SP101, but I don't wear cargo pants anymore. I have a 2 pairs of pants that I can comfortably pocket carry my P365 though. If all my pants had pockets that big, the Sig would go with me every time.

[bersaguy]

I have only been to Memphis 2 times and both times were non stop times. I grew up in Chicago till I was 16 and my parents where given a rather large Ranch/Farm by my grand father because it became to much for him to run any longer. He gave them the ranch house for us to live in while he lived in the farm house. There was about 850 acres of pasture land for cattle, about 10 acres for a hog lot 40 acres for horses and 1500 acres of timber. I graduated high school and got notice that I would be receiving draft notice so rather than wait I joined the Navy and after boot applied for Special Forces and got accepted. I had heard a lot of people talk about Memphis and quite a few said it was a small Chicago. That was kept me from going to Memphis.  I trained with four different long guns for two years in between assignments. 

[Kywldcts]

1 hour ago, deerslayer said:

I guess I just live a different lifestyle from some.  Good example - earlier today I found some evidence in my storage building out back that made me take a sudden trip to the store to get some mouse traps.  I was wearing simple running shorts because I had planned to just piddle around the house all day.  Keys, wallet, two phones (I'm on call at work), and a pocket knife later, the running shorts were out the window before a carry gun was even a consideration.  Two minutes later, I was out the door with the above mentioned necessities plus a Sig 365 Fuse in an IWB holster under my t-shirt (a legit fighting pistol IMO, but hardly full size), all riding in a pair of light duty cargo shorts (my standard attire nine months a year anyway).  I guess a standard 365, Glock 43, or even a j-frame in my front pocket would have also sufficed, but a smaller .380 or .25 was pointless.  I don't dress like a tier 1 bearded go-fast bro, but I still never find myself in a situation where a 9 ounce BB gun is all that will work.  

I have a P365XL and there’s no way I could pocket carry it or clip it to gym shorts with an Ulticlip and comfortably go for a walk.  Despite the small size it’s still double + the weight of the Bodyguard.  Don’t get me wrong, I love 9mm and even .40, but I don’t feel under armed with 10+1 or 12+1 of .380.  

[deerslayer]

25 minutes ago, Kywldcts said:

I have a P365XL and there’s no way I could pocket carry it or clip it to gym shorts with an Ulticlip and comfortably go for a walk.  Despite the small size it’s still double + the weight of the Bodyguard.  Don’t get me wrong, I love 9mm and even .40, but I don’t feel under armed with 10+1 or 12+1 of .380.  

None of my pockets are big enough for a 365XL, but a plain jane P365 would work.  I’ve occasionally pocket carried a Glock 43 and a Smith 442 over the years and would like to try a P365, since on paper it’s a little smaller than my 43.  With regular shorts and a belt (my typical garb), a 17 ounce 365 would be no big deal for me weight-wise.  But as rarely as I pocket carry, I should probably save that $500. 

I have run and ridden bikes with a 43 and even a 48 in the past with gym shorts, but I always used a belly band.  I’ve also used the belly band with the 48 on a couple occasions when I had to dress up.  It worked well.  

[Moped]

1 hour ago, deerslayer said:

I have a friend who pocket carries (and conceals) a 26 with a red dot.  I'm 5'10/190 and could never pull that off, but he is more the offensive line type.  

I could pull that off in my overalls. Not my slacks or jeans.