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PAULSHOOT

SW22 Victory - Ejection Problem - ? About Fix (Bend Ejector)

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I am frustrated with a new (new to me - it is used) SW22 Victory I bought TUE at BUD's in Sevierville. Good deal price wise at $249 with 5 Mags (all have the TANDEMKROSS extension), and a "T" Trigger, and a "T" Halo , don't know about the Hammer (if it is or isn't a "T"). Guess about $260 in extras by previous owner. 

I broke it down TUE and cleaned it up and lubricated it. It looked to be in good shape, not a lot of wear indications.  

I shot it WED or TRIED TO SHOOT it with all the Failures to Eject (say from 3 to 5 per MAG, did get some MAGS to run 7 and one actually did 10). Many, many, many FTE with all types of AMMO (CCI MINI MAG, CCI Blazer Brass, Aquilla High Velocity, Remington Golden). 

Found out about all the ejection problems and THE FIX (one fix is to bend the ejector). Seems to work for many folks

WHAT I CAN'T find is How To Bend The Ejector.

And, whether to bend it IN to center of gun or bend it OUT away from center. I think IN or OUT  might be a choice depending on how the ejector fits in the gun. Some said it was not gripping the cartridge Rim (bend it IN) -- Some said it was rubbing as bent in too far (bend it OUT).

STILL -- How to efect the Bend???  

ALSO, see TANDEMKROSS has after market ejector and a .PDF procedure on how to change it. 

I would surely appreciate a more detailed discussion on the Bend Method (exactly how to bend the ejector).

PS: Other than the eject problems (I kept clearing and shooting for nearly an hour). I like the trigger pull, the accuracy including the sight picture.

BTW, Sight picture is always a bit of a problem for me (Bifocals). Probably be nice to have some special shooting prescription glasses to make sight picture better.
 

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Exactly how is it failing to eject? Round staying the chamber? Case not clearing the slide? Stovepipe? Which way is the case pointing when jammed and exactly where is it in the gun? Problem could be ejector or extractor or both. Need more info to troubleshoot properly. 

Actually, the best solution is to take it back to Bud's and see what they can do for you. 

Edited by Grayfox54

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mine had fte when I first got it and if I remember right I bent mine in but if you bend it too far it hits something in there. Sorry I can't be more helpful on the actual bending part but I am going off memory and its been a couple of years. With that being said mine has worked really well with few problems after that, either running with a can or not.

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Thanks for the replies -- try to answer both here. IT GETS LONG, sorry. 

Answer --Type FTE are all above: Stovepipes, Hang up that don't even make it out of the breach (not sure I am using the right term there), Wedged into the area to left of the ramp (had to take a screwdriver on my knife to pry those out). And while that is going on,  sometimes it has partially loaded the next round. That is projectile of the next round has started into the chamber and bullet is at an angle (usually results in a damaged case or loosened projectile). In other words - It Is A Mess. 

Question --- On the bend extractor procedure (I am sorry,  been calling extractor the ejector). There is no way in this world to bend the extractor in my opinion? 

I took the Extractor Assy (Extractor, Plunger, and Spring) out today to see if I could figure out what the "BEND FIX" is or how to do it.  Not trying to start an argument, but in my opinion there is no way to bend the extractor unless with a lot of special machine equipment (it is small and a very hard metal). So, I don't know what folks are talking about. You can't push it IN because it rests against metal on the slide, bolt, next to where the end of the cartridge case sets. The hook on the extractor looks OK to this untrained eye, and it extends out over the rim of the cartridge. Seems to cover the rim OK.  

STATUS -- What I did do, was clean the extractor assembly (extractor, plunger, and spring) and the area where it is inserted. I also stretched the spring a bit to give it more tension. I also tried to file the "U" (call it the "U") of the extractor to maybe let it cover the rim of the cartridge case a bit better (doubt I filed anything off as it is hard metal and actually it looks like the hook covers the rim now).  

ALL THAT was  NO HELP. I found out by taking it to BUD's and asking the manager to allow me to shoot a couple MAGS on the range FREE. That to check if I had helped the situation. He did and even gave me some rounds to shoot (I had left AMMO in the car). The first MAG had at least  4 FTE before I gave up and quit (CCI MINI MAGS). He said, when you get the new extractor assembly installed - come back and try it again. I had told him I ordered one from S&W today. 

The manager also looked at the gun and thought all was functioning OK (slide tension, extractor tension).  I also compared it to a new SW22 Victory as far as slide friction and spring tension(just by feel of pulling it back). They both felt the same to me.

You get a tightening at the same point about 1/2 inch from all the way back as I remember. I think  normal spring tension.  Just saying -- it';s not a friction on  the slide that prevents the case from clearing the breach (that word again).

One More THING -- I called S & W Techie (customer service). Explained it was a used gun I bought and registered on their web site, was surprised I could register if previous owner registered it.  He said good to register whether new or used in case of recalls or if lost or stolen. 

I explained what was going on and started to discuss the  "Bend Fix" (see if he knew about such).  He interrupted and said send it in, to get it fixed. They provide FREE shipping label, but there would be a FEE for repair (apparently not under warranty for new owner). 

I asked about cost of repair if extractor and he said he did not know (another department).

I found out an extractor is $3 and the assembly (includes extractor, plunger, and spring) is $6. I ordered the assembly ( be here in a week or so0.

If that does not fix it, guess I will send it in and see what the FEE will be? Might be too much to make it worth while (who knows, new slide, bolt, or what). Shoot it as it is?  GROAN. 

DANG would think S & W Warranty would transfer with gun and be lifetime (heck many cheaper guns are (Ones I own - TAURUS, HERITAGE, and I think the GSG). Buy American. 😉   

If nothing else - I hope all this is at least INFO for someone and really HOPE someone has a fix (not likely unless a gunsmith that had the gun in hand). 

That said, THANKS for any INFO. 

PS: I would send pictures if not such a procedure to do so. 

 

    

Edited by PAULSHOOT

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What kind a lubricant are you using? And how much?

Your guns seem to be running into these issues pretty regularly of late. 

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4 minutes ago, MacGyver said:

What kind a lubricant are you using? And how much?

Your guns seem to be running into these issues pretty regularly of late. 

Cleaned gun with HOPPEs, and used gun oil (drop as shown in book TUE, then shot it WED about 100 rounds (the FTE's)  

THU AM, cleaned again and used 5W 20 Full Synthetic Motor Oil (light coat on rails, etc.), before shooting it today. ONE MAG and several FTE's.

The slide is very smooth to move.  

    

Edited by PAULSHOOT

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I'm not familiar with that particular pistol. But it does sound like and ejector problem to me. The empty case isn't clearing the chamber before the slide starts to pick up the next round. Could be a broken, worn or bent ejector. I'd check that first.  

Try putting an empty case in the chamber and slowly draw the slide back while watching exactly what the case does as it being pulled out. I would think that bending the ejector in just a tad might give the empty case a little more kick to throw it out quicker. Do this just a tiny bit at a time and test. Bending too far may break the ejector or cause interference with other parts. 

This is actually a common problem with older Marlin .22 rifles. In their case the ejector, which is part of the feed block, becomes worn and doesn't kick the case out fast enough. For them the cure is to replace the feed block with one that has the new style ejector.  I know as I have done it. 

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10 hours ago, Grayfox54 said:

I'm not familiar with that particular pistol. But it does sound like and ejector problem to me. The empty case isn't clearing the chamber before the slide starts to pick up the next round. Could be a broken, worn or bent ejector. I'd check that first.  

Try putting an empty case in the chamber and slowly draw the slide back while watching exactly what the case does as it being pulled out. I would think that bending the ejector in just a tad might give the empty case a little more kick to throw it out quicker. Do this just a tiny bit at a time and test. Bending too far may break the ejector or cause interference with other parts. 

This is actually a common problem with older Marlin .22 rifles. In their case the ejector, which is part of the feed block, becomes worn and doesn't kick the case out fast enough. For them the cure is to replace the feed block with one that has the new style ejector.  I know as I have done it. 

1) I agree (At Least I HOPE) that is is an ejector problem. I did check the ejector, I had the whole assembly (ejector, plunger, spring) out of the gun. The hook looks good (to me - I am not a gunsmith) and as I said above there is no way to bend the ejector (maybe with a sophisticated machine designed for that) as it is only about 3/8 inch long, 3/16 wide and very hard metal. 

I did not mention above post that I did try to file the "U" (I call it a U) of the ejector which would allow it to close on the rim more (sort of like bending it if you could bend it).  Not sure I really manged to file much off as it is hard metal, I did change the surface from black to shinny. Anyway, that filing attempt along with a slight stretch on the ejector spring did NOT HELP the problem. I Had 4 FTE on the next MAG of CCI MINI MAX 10 rounds when tested at BUD'S range with the manager.

2) Suggestion to check what an empty case does as slowly draw the slide back might reveal something (I will try it with a live round as don't have a spent round available at home and no place to fire the gun here). However, not sure what it would reveal as slide does not slowly go back when a round is fired (while different situation).

I DID after I worked on the ejector and spring put two live rounds in a MAG and feed them by hand (did not fire the gun - just pointed it at the ground in case it fired) and they ejected nicely (pulling the slide back by hand).

I also laid a live round in the bolt (slide) where a round would set against the firing pin area when I had the bolt, slide, out of the gun. It appears the ejector hook is covering the rim (as my naked eye with out magnification could see).  As Is aid, the hook on the ejector, plunger, and spring look OK to me (not a gunsmith). 

THAT SAID -- It may be there is enough wear on the ejector, plunger, and spring that it is still the problem (I HOPE cause then a new ejector assembly might fix it). I have an ejector assembly ordered from S & W for $6 (reasonable). We shall see. 

The plunger is a plastic like material and the spring pushes it against the backside of the ejector to force it against over the rim of the case. It could be worn in such away as to not keep a good pressure on the case.  

Thanks for your time to reply. Good folks on this site. 

Edited by PAULSHOOT

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Another long post (copy of a correspondence with S & W).

I submitted a contact on the form on S & W  web site and they responded within an hour (I was AMAZED).  Also, in the reply, they immediately sent a shipping label for me to send the gun back FREE. I will if the new ejector assembly does not fix it. 

Purpose of my contact was to find out when this gun was manufactured. That turned out to 12/22/2016 (so I think that would be a later model and it would be a couple months short of 2 years old -- I don't know when it was originally sold).

This correspondence gets LONG cause I gave them the history and some comments as well as asking the question  about when it was Mfg'ed.  

------------------- Their Reply to My MSG which is Below ---------------

Dear Paul,

We would like to thank you for your e-mail and contacting Smith & Wesson / Thompson Center.

Your firearm was produced 12/22/2016.

You should receive an email shortly from a “Do Not Reply” Address detailing how to return your firearm for service. Print out the label in the email and attach it to the outside of a sturdy box.

Send only the firearm. Do not send in magazines or any other accessories that may have come with the firearm. Please Include a note inside the box detailing the problems you are having with your firearm and we will evaluate it once it has been processed in the repair area.

If your return is deemed to be a non-warranty repair an estimate of charges will be generated and mailed to you. Your RMA reference number is _______.

Average turnaround time for warranty repairs at this time is approximately 2-4 weeks for most repairs.

If you have any other questions please feel free to contact us

Thank you and have Great Day!

Smith&Wesson values its customers and we are happy to have served you today. Please do not hesitate to contact us should you require further assistance.

Regards, Steve

For a limited time only, we are offering our official S&W M&P Black Performance Ear Muff for a new low price of $15.99 each plus shipping while supplies last. This is almost 20% off the regular price of $19.95. Please use the link below to view the ear muffs on our website.

---------------Original Message That I Sent Them---------------

From: Paul 
Subject: no subject
  Background - I just registered a SW22 Victory (used gun I bought at BUD'S in Sevierville) - S/N_______

Also called and talked to a Tech at S&W about FTE (Fail to Eject) when I took it to shoot day after I bought it (bought on 10-09-2018 and shot it on 10-10-2018. MY MISTAKE  was not shooting before I bought it cause it fails so much (3 to 5 times on a 10 RD MAG that using various brands of AMMO. GROAN That was after cleaning and lubing per the book the night before I shot it.

Other than that the gun shoots (no misfires) every time  one gets in the chamber - shot about 100 rounds that day. The slide seems normal comapred to anew gun at BUD's and the fact it fires good indicates those mechanisims are OK. 🙂

And I like the sight picture and it's accurate (as my shooting is).

I took the extractor, plunger, spring out THU morning and cleaned those as well as the gun, and lubed again. I stretched the spring a bit (parts look OK to me and the hook seems to cover the rim). Took it to the range and BUD's Manager let me try a MAG FREE (BTW, he thought extractor and slide spring tension was good)  NO HELP, it FTE after every one or two rounds at the most on the first MAG of CCI MINI MAGS (so, I quit shooting).

That is the history, except to say very disappointed in my purchase and BUD'S for selling such, and me not shooting it before I bought it. Then finding out S & W does not have a warranty that follows the gun. My cheap Hi-Point 380 and TAURUS 9MM does. 😞 Buy American?

Anyway, I ordered the Extractor Assy when talking to the TECH and will install it (HOPE FOR A FIX).

The TECH said I could send in with a FREE Shipping Label and would be a FEE to FIX. So I will do that if the new Extractor does not fix. I would want an estimate on the fix FEE before ordering it fixed.

ONE MORE THING -- curious to know if this is a very old model or a newer model, CAN YOU ANSWER THAT with S/N ______  

 

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It will get fixed one way or another but I think you are confusing EXTRACTOR with EJECTOR.

The Ejector is spot welded to the frame and shoves the spent case out.  The Extractor is the claw thing on the bolt itself that holds onto the case.

Look at post #30 in this thread for pics on bending the Ejector.

http://smith-wessonforum.com/smith-wesson-semi-auto-pistols/462336-sw22-victory-not-ejecting.html

Edited by Garufa

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45 minutes ago, PAULSHOOT said:
   
   
 
ONE MORE THING -- curious to know if this is a very old model or a newer model, CAN YOU ANSWER THAT with S/N ______  
 

 

"Very old" sort of non-sequitur since it was introduced less than 3 years ago.

- OS

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Garufa is dead on. You're mistaking the extractor for the ejector. The link he posted should cure your problem. Just be very careful and don't break it as its part of the frame and only the factory could fix it if broken. They may have to replace the frame as I think the part its welded to is molded in. 

If you're the least bit unsure about doing this, send it back to S&W. 

BTW: I did find a parts list on-line. They do not list an ejector at all. This seems to fit my theory that it is indeed part of the frame. 

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6 hours ago, Garufa said:

It will get fixed one way or another but I think you are confusing EXTRACTOR with EJECTOR.

The Ejector is spot welded to the frame and shoves the spent case out.  The Extractor is the claw thing on the bolt itself that holds onto the case.

Look at post #30 in this thread for pics on bending the Ejector.

http://smith-wessonforum.com/smith-wesson-semi-auto-pistols/462336-sw22-victory-not-ejecting.html

yes that is what I did to mine, it has worked just fine since I did it.

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On 10/12/2018 at 3:56 PM, Garufa said:

It will get fixed one way or another but I think you are confusing EXTRACTOR with EJECTOR.

The Ejector is spot welded to the frame and shoves the spent case out.  The Extractor is the claw thing on the bolt itself that holds onto the case.

Look at post #30 in this thread for pics on bending the Ejector.

http://smith-wessonforum.com/smith-wesson-semi-auto-pistols/462336-sw22-victory-not-ejecting.html

I REALLY REALLY Appreciate your (Garufa) effort to send a Post and even the reply number that resulted in correcting my ignorance about the process of ejecting a round. 🙂 🙂 

As I now understand things -- the EXTRACTOR grabs the spent case and pulls it out of the chamber, then the EJECTOR tips the case out of the gun as the slide brings it back to the Ejector.

I always wondered what that little pointed "THINGY" was on various guns.  Now, I know it's the Ejector and can see how you could bend it.

Also, thanks for the other replies, good folks on here.

I will take a close look at the alignment of the Ejector (maybe one can slowly pull the slide back and see if the Ejector is going to contact the spent case). 

PS: I betcha that is the problem as I have never seen a spent case left in the Chamber. So, the Extractor is pulling them out, but they are not being Ejected out of the gun.

PSS; Also, appreciate the comment about being careful, don't break it as it is welded and would have to send it in to S & W to get it fixed. (I saw a comment on a U-Tube about that "Thingy" being welded on and that guy may have called it the Ejector and talked about bending it -- I did not pick up on that at the time).  I ain't a Gun Smith. LOL

PSSS: Would think S & W would have heard or seen this FIX and suggested it to me when I called and talked to a TECHIE about the issue with this gun.    

 

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Took a look at it and I THINK it is fixed, will not know until I shoot it.

I think a good way yo do the "Bent the Ejector)" is as I did. Maybe easier to not go to the trouble removing the Barrel, Frame, Slide that I did, but I liked seeing what I was working on and bending just enough to make good contact with the case VS  reaching in with long nose pliers and guessing.

1) I took barrel, frame, and slideoff the grip (used the take down screw).

2) I turned the barrel, frame, and slide upside down. You can then see the Extractor, Ejector, and a spent case as you pull the slide back toward the ejector.

NOTE: I used an Allen wrench to hold the case in the extractor as I slid the slide back. Used Allen size smaller than 1/8 inch and stick the small side of the Allen into the case and go in from the side to set the case in the Extractor.  (Wish I could put pictures in VS trying to describe things).  

3) I then noted as I pushed the slide back, I could go past the Ejector with the case (have a picture that shows that). The Ejector did make some contact with the case sometime (kind of like sometimes the gun ran a few rounds before a FTE).

4) I started prying the Ejector over toward the center of the gun with a screw driver against the frame. I guess you call the Bending It, but not like putting a sharp bend in it. You just push it over a bit and it springs back.  Then checked where it was visually  (can see it with barrel and frame removed from the grip and laid upside down on a bench).  

5) Basically, keep doing Step 4 until it appears the Ejector was seated better and then a final check with the Case installed again.

You can't push the slide past the Ejector when the Ejector is tight. (BTW, have to hold the case in place with the Allen wrench as you slide it back to make contact with the ejector). 

I HOPE The Gun WORKS now -- pretty sure it will as never had a case where the Extractor did not pull the case out of the Chamber (it just wouldn't eject out of the gun). 

THANKS to Everyone -- I will let you know final outcome. And, I hope this helps anyone having a SW Victory FTE problem.   

  

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It appears to be FIXED --- shot 60 rounds today (5 different AMMOs) and no FTE.

I had 2 FTL and one of those happened at the same time the MAG dropped down. Not sure what caused the MAG to drop, but it happened twice and i think with the same MAG (have them numbered 1 thru 5) 

Thanks especially to Garufa for setting me straight on what an Ejector is VS an Extractor.  

Edited by PAULSHOOT
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3 hours ago, PAULSHOOT said:

It appears to be FIXED --- shot 60 rounds today (5 different AMMOs) and no FTE.

I had 2 FTL and one of those happened at the same time the MAG dropped down. Bot sure what caused the MAG to drop, but it happened twice and i think with the same MAG (have them numbered 1 thru 5) 

Thanks especially to Garufa for setting me straight on what an Ejector is VS an Extractor.  

Glad that’s what it was and you got it running!

Edited by Garufa
  • Like 1

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