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Our neighbor came over today and walked up on us (my 14yr old daughter and myself) in the garage where we were cleaning a couple of rifles. He got a puzzled look on his face and asked if I was making her do that. She politely said no that she was cleaning her rifle while I cleaned mine. He looked more puzzled and asked why in the world was such a pretty girl worried about hunting. She explained that she could not be less interested in hunting, that she had other reasons for learning to shoot. When he asked what they were she very boldly quoted a picture she found on the internet that she, and her mom, both like....... [URL=http://s1356.photobucket.com/user/sbj9148/media/IMG950511_zpsd59e6994.jpg.html][/URL] I could not have been more proud. I am hoping that this will discourage the neighbors son from comming around so much to LOL

Since the prosecution has rested its case, most everyone has made up their mind on guilt, so let's turn to the lessons we (and everyone, frankly) should learn from this tragedy... from the different perspectives. VERY IMPORTANT: It's not necessary to KNOW what happened to learn something from what MIGHT have happened. Each side of this case has important lessons learned.   GZ: Never lose situational awareness. GZ: Never put yourself in vulnerable position when the police are on their way. GZ: Be prepared to be authoritative... and quickly.  "You got a problem with me?"   "I'm neighborbood watch captain; what are you doing here?" GZ: Do not do anything illegal when watching suspicious persons. (Not saying he did. It's just a good take away lesson for everyone if he did.)   TM: If a child is chased by an unknown person at night, get to a safe place. Find an adult or police. Call the police. Call a parent. For goodness sake, don't get distracted by talking to another teenager on the phone. TM: Never confront an unknown, suspicious person. You might be carrying fists into a gun fight. TM: As a kid, never get into an altercation with an adult. The authorities are going to believe the adult.   S. Fulton: Parents, for goodness sakes, give your kids some tough love if they get suspended. Teach your kids that actions have consequences. Set a curfew. Take away the phone for a week. Suspend phone service. Suspend internet service. It took a 5-minute google search to come up with these ideas, so there's probably better actions, but this is a start. S. Fulton: If your kid is doing something wrong, monitor their texts, tweets, emails, and facebook to see what the kid is up to.   I'm sure there are a lot more lessons we can learn from this. What are your thoughts?

  Well...better than being killed; just don't defend yourself.  In fact, why carry a weapon or get involved at all. We should all learn that the next time we see someone in your neighborhood acting suspicious we just need to go inside or keep driving to the store and hope that the suspicious looking stranger is just out for some skittles.  After all, if he isn't and he actually is up to something...well...we can be secure in the knowledge that he'll likely be some other person's problem.  I mean...why get involved at all; there's no reason for us to give a s**t about anyone else anyway.  :rolleyes:

I could not agree with this statement more, however, I'm not convinced that this should have any bearing on our current marriage license issuance. I get that venomous liberals will do this in order to further their agenda, but reasonably I have no argument for why I or anyone else should care if the government suddenly recognizes marriages between gays as legitimate. Every argument against it has referenced "sanctity of marriage", but how can one use that argument with our divorce rate and other societal marriage issues occurring in traditional marriage? There is the nature argument, and while I'd agree that nature does not intend for same sex individuals to procreate, who cares? How does that translate into law? And the theme I often see relates to homo activity as a sin according to God, but religion shouldn't dictate our laws, especially when there are folks from other faiths who says their God doesn't care. I am of the opinion that the gov should not be involved in marriage at all, and I also am of the opinion that will never happen. So logically we are left with two options: continue not to recognize gay marriage as legitimate in the eyes of the government based on a combination of religious beliefs and emotional pleas "for the children/sanctity of marriage", or allow gay marriage to be recognized. I'm leaning towards the latter because there are more logical reasons to allow it than to not allow it. I've asked before and I'll ask again, I would really like an argument against gay marriage that is not based on religion or emotion.

Don't feel too bad. Last year I almost blew a hole through my front door because I was convinced someone was getting ready to kick it in.     Turns out it was the wreath my girlfriend hung on the door. Through the peep hole it looked like someone's shoulder trying to stand off to the side.   my GF "It's the wreath you big idiot" 

Here is my 2 cents worth...  Deputy Ross needs to be arrested for kidnapping under the color of law and he needs to be judged my a jury of his peers, and if found guilty needs to face the maximum penalty under the law.  He clearly violated this guys rights and did so knowingly without PC (PC is the required level for a DUI checkpoint).  He used the threat of force while armed to forcibly detain this citizen under the color of law which meets all the requirements for kidnapping under both TN and Federal law.   We all should be calling and emailing the Rutherford County Sheriff to at the very least encourage him to fire this deputy who can't seem to handle situations where no crime has been committed.  It's clear that Deputy Ross and the dog handler knew they were doing something wrong, because they stopped talking once they noticed the camera, and turned it so it could no longer view them...  That to me is a clear sign of their guilt.  If an officer can't handle a rude citizen without violating both the law, civil rights and department policy he should no longer be wearing a uniform.   Also, my guess is that dog handlers days are done...  any future case where he is the K9 officer, the defense is going to play that video over and over again and impeach his credibility.

I don't have any tats.  I wanted to be different.

    I would answer it must be genuine confusion.   I do not see how procreation is a valid reason for marriage benefits in the form of tax breaks.  And why those procreation benefits would then be a reason why gays can't marry.  And if those tax breaks are valid reasons then why didn't the .gov have a problem with me marrying.

It's really this simple. :)  Language warning...   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uj0mtxXEGE8

Well since you seconded ... Marriage benefits were originaly a way to help ease the tremendous burden of procreating & raising progeny. Now I guess granting/bestowing marriage benefits are nothing more than just another way for the government to toss our tax dollars at whomever or whatever screams loudly enough in demand of them. How's that for a non-religous answer?

Threads like this oft remind me that this is a gun forum and NOT a pro-small government forum of Constitution loving people. Some of you steadfastly desire to protect your 2nd amendment rights, yet are willing to turn a blind eye to offenses to other parts of the Constitution such as this. We can debate whether DUI checkpoints and listening to my cell phone conversations are legal under today's skewed interpretation of the Constitution where freedom and liberty take a back seat to "safety," but there is no question in my mind that this type of search (mind you, where the officers ADMIT he is innocent and they fabricated their 'weak alert') is why the founding fathers wrote the 4th amendment. Worse, some of you even offer support to criminal LEOs such as this. Shame on you! This officer deserves a flogging in the public square and to be thrown in jail for as long as can be. How many of you would prefer this young man be out vandalizing property, doing drugs, or driving intoxicated? You would certainly be quick to write that off as another "failure of today's youth." But when he dare question the government many of you helped vote into being (and now complain about), he's "out looking for trouble." Non-violent civil disobedience against an intrusive and tyrannical government should never be washed away as "some kid out looking for trouble." Rather supported for doing its part in maintaining the true meaning of the Constitution. Anyway ... rant off. In summary; threads like these only prove to me that if given the chance, many of you would continue to vote the John McCain's and Lindsey Graham's of the world into office.

Maybe I'm being judgmental, but something tells me this dude doesn't fit the description of "normal business person." If he actually has/knows attorneys, my money is on them being liberal community organizing activists that he knows from "rallies".

Yup it is all over social network sites, comments on those sites seem to be a mixture of "the kid should done what ever police told him" & "his rights were violated". Personally I've always believed that iffin I was to ever error, at least I'd be erroring on the side of liberty, I hope to continue that trend, I just wish more folks would join me in that.

Low camp!  Putting a tat on a beautiful woman is like putting a coon tail on a Lexus. :yuck:  Never had one, never wanted one. Now, where can this old dog hide.

If everyone in positions of authority would take a little time to learn the rights of the people, cherish these rights as their own (which they are) and abide by them in their duties, then there would be no need for so called "Jerks" (no matter what their age) to video tape rights violations....that IS the bottom line.

AMEN BROTHER...! Samual Adams once said "If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquillity of servitude than the animating contest of freedom—go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen!" Subversion is a powerful tool to bring the masses under submission.

I'm a whitewater kayaker, and there used to be a company called Lotus that made paddling gear, the most popular piece being a life jacket, Their logo was a lotus flower,and they placed it on the life jackets at a position roughly between the top of the shoulder blades . Now, the lotus flower symbol was not particularly manly looking, but in the kayaking community it was immediately recognizable, and several men thought it would be a good idea to ink it onto their backs in the same location as the life jacket. Seemed like a good idea at the time. Fast forward several years and now the company is out of business and nearly forgotten about and we have all these guys with these girly flowers on their backs. Makes me laugh every time I see one.

  The same could be said about guns.  The majority of gun owners are responsible (as are drivers I would argue), so should we put up with random checks of our guns and background to make sure we should still be able to possess guns?  Because some act irresponsible isn't a valid reason for me that the government should be able to do whatever they want, including bullying people into submission.  If irresponsibility is the deciding factor, we are doomed.

We are the world largest debtor nation.   The federal government took over the public education system and standards, now we're like #17 in the world in education.   America doesn't manufacturer anything anymore since NAFTA, GATT & the World Trade Organization.   A 17 trillion dollars debt that's impossible to pay off. We're insolvent and bankrupt.   We are losing our freedoms and being watched and monitored like never before.   The dollar is about to lose it's standing as the worlds reserve currency.   The majority of Americans have much more debt than savings and assets.   Your mortgage is not even American owned. It was bundled and sold to foreigners and they own your home / property mortgage.   A very large segment of the population expects and demands a living without production or work and getting larger everyday.   Could go on and on...

  Shhh. I like seeing these videos of people getting their ass kicked 'cause they don't know any better :)

Anyone wishing to question checkpoints can go to a city council, or in this case, a county commission meeting. By the roadside, late at night is not the place.

and I'd like to thank everyone here that makes this forum the best one I've ever had the privilege to join.  Many forums have come and gone for me, usually in a very short time.  But, after 1 1/2 years, I still enjoy the heck outta this place and visit practically every day.  I haven't met many of you in person, about 6 or 7, but everyone I've met has been really good people and a joy to meet. I've learned a lot on here about a lot of things and was even inspired to get back into reloading by reading the information ya'll have posted.  I've found some really good deals and websites that have saved me money too. David and the Moderators have a lot of class and seem to keep things in line, but I'm thinking that it's not too hard of a job because of all the class we have as members too.   Anyway, ya'll carry-on.  This :up: is for TGO, a fine group of like minded people willing to help and share..!!

That you do, but action without wise and thoughtful focus can easily do more harm than good.   The Tea Party has not been the only group active in speaking out against creeping government power.  The Libertarian Party has been doing it since 1971, but Tea Party followers like to pretend that they are pioneers in calling for limited government.  I'm baffled why this recent upstart gets credibility from people in the movement while the Libertarians are treated like fringe lunatics.  The Tea Party is a loosely affiliated group with no clear mission or platform, while the Libertarians have been active at trying to have candidates elected to office for decades.  

TMF.  I think the recent supreme court thing on DOMA was exactly what you say.  What the state regulates, the state has to even-handly enforce.  It's the old "equal protection under law" thing.  Like you, im ok with that.   Ray Charles could see that DOMA would be struck down if the court wuz fair as soon as there wuz more than one kind of marriage recognized by the state.   As to the "pop culture" tolerance thing; i think lots of folks are intimidated into backing certain things because of peer pressure. It's "tolerance jhad" at work.  It's a tool used to further the "movement" based on wanting to be "part of the crowd" by those who dont take the time to think things thru.  It's fodder for the "children" and 'beings of lower estate"..    Im like you and some others, i dont believe that you can say you are for personal liberty, then limit the liberties of a certain class of citizens with discriminatory law passed to salve some political constituency.   I think you are exactly right  RE: the "....state meddling in marriage..." thing.  They need to get out of that business.  As you have also opined, sadly, i dont think for a minute that they will.  I say, get married in church if ya like that (...i happen to, that's what we did years ago...).  If ya dont like that one, get married where ever else ya want to.   leroy

I have learned my family is probably better off if I am killed rather than use a gun to defend myself.

Yep, getting out of the truck and chasing someone you believe to be suspicious while you're carrying is good to go. Nothing bad will ever come of that. Seriously, I've been saying from the start (guilty or innocent) there is a very good lesson HCP holders could learn from Zman's case. Instead of recognizing that we're still playing "you must think Trayvon kneels at the cross" game. Good stuff. If folks can't learn from the jackassery of others they deserve all the consequences coming their way.

Come on...you guys are getting sloppy. Mystery creature at night and it takes until post#18 for this feller to show up?

:popcorn: ..............Hope I've got enough popcorn. No way is this gonna stay on topic. :rofl:

Seems like Zimmerman could have followed that advice, hmm?

Caveat: All below are in my opinion only.   The following words are by John Wycliff and pertain to understanding the Bible, However the same guidelines can be used to understand the Constitution of the United States.   "It shall greatly helpe ye to understande Scripture, If thou mark not only what is spoken or wrytten, But of whom, and to whom, With what words, At what time Where, To what intent, With what circumstances, Considering what goeth before and what followeth (context)."     We don't need to amend the Constitution, we need to read and and understand what the original writers meant to begin with. The Tea Parties (there is not ONE party, but many, each with different ideas and purposes and they  pretty much rewrite the Constitution to their own purposes, just like the other two "Gangs" in Washington     Democratic Party= Populist Liberals= Demographic Welfare= Socialism "Everybody should be rich"   Republican Party= Corporate Liberals= Corporate Welfare (Crony Capitalism) =Greatly Modified Fascism "Only the rich should have anything"   Conservatives= "Work hard and make your own wealth" = We buried Goldwater= End of the Breed   Conclusion: For all the posturing and BS, there are no Conservatives in our government at this time.

A lot of "If"s in this case. Just one change and things would be very diff. I have told my kids "easiest way to stay out of trouble is to stay away from trouble".

First find a TWRA Hunter's Safety class. The dates/locations and details are available on the TWRA website. There is an online version also, but it is far less informational IMHO.   Second, find a mentor. Someone that you can hunt with will keep the sport more fun for you on slow days. For me, hunting is far more about fellowship than harvest.    Learn to walk quietly. :)

I am not sure I could have been as calm. I know I would have used the tazer a little earlier and not with a contact shot. I would have stood back a few feet and fired the probes that way he can squirm his way out of it. Then he would have taken that 50K volt ride until he stepped out of his vehicle voluntarily. This probably would have been less tramatic for the kid than having an officer lean over her while trying to fight someone the kid loves.   And the guy himself is a sorry excuse for a parent/roll model for several reasons. First, if he exposed the kid to drugs by either smoking it or having it in the car he needs to go to jail. Second, by not complying in a calm manner he has likely traumatized the child for life.

Midget ninjas wearing night-vision goggles?

Best video I've seen on zeroing. http://youtu.be/60zbwMYJiLI

I tend to pay little attention to the tin foil stuff flooding the Internet right now. Although, AR is right about one thing. Tid bits of info in these videos and articles are accurate. If you do your due diligence and research what is happening and use your intelligence to put the puzzle together I think you will find that things aren't exactly roses anymore. I agree that we have always heard people screaming about how the sky falling, but it would be unwise to ignore some of the things currently unfolding. Our nation is over $17 trillion in debt, which is unprecedented. It is absolutely unsustainable and is a direct threat to our national security, as well as global stability. Our leadership is only adding to it instead of trying to reduce it. China is in the midst of a huge military build up and is quickly gaining global influence. Russia is following suit. Those two nations have one thing in common, they do not like the U.S. Of course, that is nothing new. BUT, when you combine that with the current global economic situation it is not good. Then, we have major hot spots in Syria, Egypt, Afghanistan, Iraq, Iran, Pakistan, North Korea, etc. This has the superpowers in the world engaged in a proxy war with each other as we speak (again, nothing new). Our country has enjoyed relative peace and economic stability for a long time due to little competition and a currency backed by a World Reserve status, along with the presence of an extremely strong military. Now, the dynamics are rapidly changing and I am honestly not sure most of our "leaders" even care. That, or they feel powerless to stop it. I believe we are in for a rough ride. It may not happen this year or the next, but something has to give eventually.

A fraction of 1% per driver stopped and harassed.  It's about the worse use of manpower/tax dollars to stop drunk drivers that any idiot could come up with.   It looks good to the sheeple public, and all the officers involved get overtime paid for by the federal government...  which is the only reason we have these types of checkpoints.      

It seems to me most Republicans are about where the Democrats were 30 to 40 years ago and the Liberals have fallen off the left side of the scale.

I just pulled my green beans. (Bush beans). I know they'll keep bearing but I like to plant late tomatos where they are. I have a 20'x40' raised bed and I planted three (40') rows of green beans. I planted them about 60 days ago and the yield was about (5) five gallon buckets full. I find it easier to harvest them standing up anyway so I pull bush and all and pick the beans on the bench. The leftover bushes get fed to my buddies live stock. Goats will nibble anything. I'm canning these beans right now. I am convinced that a good green bush bean is one of the very best garden items for SHTF/survival living. The turn around time and yield is excellent. They require almost zero maintenance. Green beans may get old after a while but they are very good for you and will keep you strong while you track down a piece of meat to add to the plate. I went on a gardening vacation for a few years but I'm back on it. I've got about forty or fifty tomatos on the vine and just planted a dozen or so more plants this morning.

Actually there are a lot of free float tubes that use the original barrel nut. Gieselle, Noveske, Rainier, some of the Midwest Industry and a few others all use the orginal barrel nut. They clamp onto the original barrel nut after you remove the delta ring and spring assembly. It is actually a pretty ingenius design and if you look at my wife's 9mm AR next time we get together you can see the setup. I would get a clamp on gas block before one that is held in place by setscrews. The one you have pictured is the one to get.On this note, I have to recommend the Troy Ind. handguards. Simple to install (3 bolts to the barrel nut), rigid, and pretty dang spiffy. They are more pricey than some of the generic free floats, but still come in well under your Daniel Defense's, Noveske's, and so on. I'm very pleased with mine

Bet it was a liger

It takes a real man to get old.  :up:

The water release schedule is subject to change...they should just say we are gonna be generating 24/7 with the exception of the times you cannot come fish. Seems my luck on the caney

People hate the government and their intrusive ways, and the police are part of the government. There will be no shortage of support for anyone who decides to push back against the establishment. 

Low and inside would be much better, eh?

I don't know if anybody is interested at all but I usually garden hydroponically during the winter. This year I plan on doing a lot of fun stuff, Brussel sprouts, cabbage, of course tomatoes, peppers(Carolina Reapers anyone?) cucumbers, and probably some okra and greens as well. If anyone is interested I will update here in the fall to show you guys how else to keep food on the table during the winter. Plus I may, key word "may" be starting aquaponics either this fall or next spring if anyone is interested.

Being active and being effective are two different things.   I think those who actually value the Constitution and think it is not just an historical document but rather, supposed to be how we freely govern ourselves, were silent for too long and our destination is now certain...the Tea Party may slow down the progression to that destination but I don't believe we can avoid it.

So DaveS question for you.   You posted this in another thread: http://www.tngunowners.com/forums/topic/65835-must-a-person-take-a-butt-whoopin-before-you-pull-a-firearm/page-3   So how is it OK for you to "let the air out of them" and Zimmerman is in the wrong for doing exactly the same thing?    You have acknowledged several times in this thread that Martin was on top of Zimmerman and he let the air out of Trayvon for using his hands in an aggressive manner. If it is legal for you to do it why is it now illegal for someone else to do it?  

Ones that just feel right to me: in wheel-gun, S&W 686 4" In semi-auto Colt Commander, Sig P226. I don't have nor ever even shot the 226... hopefully soon!

Here are some signs of pressure on primers: Flattening of primers is indication of pressure but primer type can affect how wasy they deform. The first two on the left are fine. The third is a sign and the fourth is the point you need to be concerned. Not saying the fourth is bad or dangerous, just saying you should have worked up to that point very, very slowly. I do not believe the third and fourth were fired by the same gun. You can see primer flow around the firing pin in three but not in four. Piercing the primer is also a sign of pressure and is bad for several reasons. First those hot gases can erode the firing pin tip affecting firing pin protrusion and that affects reliability. Second the gases go into the bolt between the firing pin and the firing pin hole. This will enlarge that hole and cause the primers to flow back into the hole like in number three above. This can cause a primer failure because the firing pin actually supports the primer some. It deposits dirt and crud inside the bolt which can affect reliability. And finally those gases can, depending on the gun, reach the shooters face. That is why it is important to wear glasses at all times but especially when doing load development. I have personally had one that you could not see a difference between the case and the primer. The primer flow was so severe the entire back of the case was flat except for the dent in the primer and a mark left by the ejector. Most of the writing was gone off the back of the case as well. After this the case was ruined. The primer pocket was so loose you could drop a primer into the primer pocket and it would fall back out. And honestly I was extremely lucky the case did not fail. That was probably the last time I pushed the envelope. How easily a primer flattens is dependent on the primers used. Federal primers tend to be the softest while some Russian primers tend to be really hard. That is why you read the primers with other signs like sticky extraction or marks on the case that were transferred by the bolt head. It is quite possible to get to a point beyond the pressure range of the cartridge without seeing signs on the primer. And finally, never exceed published data. At least not without knowing what you are doing and doing it very slowly. I have spoken to a lot of new reloaders and they say they start at the max load and work down. That is a very bad practice because some guns can affect pressure. And being new to reloading where would you want the mistake to happen, at the minimum or the maximum load data? That is why it is better to start low and work up. Also, I have never found a bullet that is more accurate at max than at significant less than max. I tend to load on the lighter end of the spectrum because it is easier on brass and easier on the gun. My go to 223 load is a 69SMK with 24.5 grains of Varget. Max is 26 grains and I have loaded to max but my groups suffered significantly. BTW, the velocity with that load in a 16" gun is 2,350 fps. And what is a safe pressure in one gun can be unsafe in another. The throat can have a significant affect on pressure and if you are already at or beyond max in one gun then fire the ammunition in another with a much shorter throat you might have problems. That is why I NEVER load at or beyond max unless it is for a specific gun. All my "universal" ammo is loaded well below max to take into account for different guns that might shoot that ammo. I know this seems like a lot of work but it is necessary to get accurate AND safe ammunition. And once you have done it for a while you get a feel for what is normal. Picture form here: http://www.larrywillis.com/pressure_signs.html