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i have a large order in for them i will not price goug

Disclaimer : I understand that most people here already get these points. I wanted to use this forum as a control before I release it into the wild. I’ve remained somewhat silent on the issue of the gun control debate that’s been raging in the traditional media and social media over the past two weeks. I’ve decided that it’s time that I say something because me and people who share my views are being demonized by those who have very little knowledge of firearms. So, without beating around the bush, let’s jump straight in. “Why does anyone need an ‘Assault Rifle’? “ I have heard this phrase so many times in the last few weeks that it’s beginning to make me nervous. Why? When a point is made over and over, the uninformed begin to pick it up and run with it. Those who don’t understand the world of firearms believe what those in the media, who also don’t understand firearms, tell them. I see a few corrections on the web but those are few and far between and will never reach the masses like CNN or FOX News. While we’re on that subject, all news organizations get it wrong. Left, right, middle, all of them get it wrong. Do me a favor, look up some of these terms that people keep throwing around, “assault weapon”, “assault rifle”, “clip”, “magazine”, “automatic”, “semi-automatic”, and inform yourself just a little. So back to the topic, of “Why I need a modern sporting rifle”, and no one in the gun community will want to say or hear this, It’s better at stopping threats than a handgun. That’s it, period. Yes it’s easy and fun to shoot. Yes it’s nice to accessorize and customize. But the fact is if men break into my home and threaten my wife, my children or myself, I know my semi-automatic modern sporting rifle will stop them better than any other firearm that I own. I don’t want to be fair, I don’t want to give them a chance, I want a better firearm than the threat and the best firearm that I have is a modern sporting rifle or an AR-15. Some will say that a shotgun is a better firearm for the home but when you see video of military or law enforcement breaching and clearing a room, they use a shotgun to open the door and switch to rifles to clear the room. If it’s the choice of military and law enforcement then it’s my choice as well. “But they make it too easy to kill!” “They’re only designed for killing as many people as fast as possible!” “The .223 ‘bullet’ is one of the most powerful ‘bullets’ in existence!” “If we could get rid of ‘assault weapons’ we would be safer!” Let me explain something to all of you who don’t quite understand how firearms work. To make it simple, firearms accept a cartridge that fits into a barrel. A pin strikes the primer on the end of the cartridge and fires a bullet out of the end of the barrel. How it gets there is different but for 99.99% of firearms, that’s how it works. A firearm that looks like my AR-15 or a firearm that looks like something out of WWII will fire that cartridge no differently and it will be no less lethal. How a firearm looks has no bearing on its lethality. I need everyone who reads this to understand that. A firearm’s appearance has no bearing on how lethal it is. I’ll say that one more time because everyone is so hung up on military “style” rifles. How a firearm looks will not affect how the bullet comes out of the end of the barrel. If you could wave a magic wand and make all “assault weapons” disappear there are still hundreds of firearms that will accept the same size cartridges. All of those firearms the gun control advocates say are acceptable to own yet they fire the same cartridge at the same velocity and have the same magazine size as today’s modern sporting rifles. They just look different. One more time in case you missed it, how a gun looks makes no difference in how it fires a cartridge. “No one needs a 30 round clip.” I do. Well, I need a 30 round magazine or more specifically I don’t need a limit on what size magazine I can own. I hear the magic number of 10. You only need a 10 round magazine. Why? Who decided that 10 rounds was the number? I can’t find any studies on the decision but it’s really popular with the gun control advocates. If we, as gun owners, concede on this decision it will go down to 5 then 3 then 1. I can hear the cries now, “If he only had 5 round magazines!” then “If he only had 3 round magazines!” Where does it stop? Let me break down some statistics for you. It typically takes 2 rounds from a rifle to stop a threat. Most trained individuals in a high-stress situation will miss 50% of their shots. So, if we do the math, If 4 men try to break into my house and harm me or my family, statistics say I need to put 2 rounds on each threat to get them to stop hurting me. We’re up to 8 rounds there and that’s if I’m perfect. Now, odds are I’ll miss 50% so we’re up to 16 rounds. What if I miss more? See where I’m going? The officers in NYC who shot a man that pointed a gun at them fired 16 rounds at one guy and they only hit him 9 times. Understand? It took 9 rounds to stop the threat. Statistics say if you are attacked, it will be by more than one person. Why does anyone need more than 10 rounds in a magazine? Most gun guys will say it’s for convenience but for me it’s about having more rounds than the men trying to kill me. Ask anyone who’s been in a gunfight if they had too much ammo. I’m guessing they would say no. Now the question is, does having a limit on magazine size make people safer? After all the outcry, interviews and opinion pieces it all boils down to that question. Does having a ban on “high-capacity” magazines make you feel safer? Or does having a 30 round magazine actually make me safer? Looking at all of the stats and numbers I’m going with the latter. With all of that being said, the point is kind of moot. One large supplier of firearm accessories said they sold 3.5 years worth of 30 round AR magazines in a week so the market is flooded. Even if they do ban them, you’ll be able to get one and so will those who want to hurt people. “It’s too easy to get guns. We need to close the gun show loophole!” A survey of prison inmates in 1997 found that less than 2% purchased their firearms at a gun show. 80% were from friends, family, stolen or from other illegal sources. A gun show is where a group of dealers go to sell stuff in one place. If you buy a gun from a dealer at a gun show you’re subject to a background check just like you would be if you went into a gun store. If you’ve ever been to a gun show you’d also know that there are several police at the front door to ensure people are not armed and that they check firearms they intend to sell. Also, the prices at gun shows are so ridiculously inflated that the average criminal wouldn’t be able to afford a firearm. Why buy one when you could just steal one from Grandma’s nightstand drawer. A potential criminal would have to be extremely stupid to go to gun show to buy a firearm. Hopefully you got something out of this. I know I didn’t offer up any solutions to crimes but that wasn’t my intent. I basically wanted to inform anyone who would take the time out of their day to read my rant because the misinformation, intentional or not, from those who can sway the argument is getting out of control. Share this on any site you want, just leave my name attached -Tim Carroll

Artwork temporarily removed.  We're going to produce some decals off of these ideas and sell them to raise a little money for the site.

i ordered 1100 i will let every one know when they come in dont usually sell mags but dont like to see people selling them for 75.00  i will chow cost on mags

:)

Actually yes. I was the first guy to work with Brian on one of these kind of articles. He has done several with the help of TGO members. He hasn't hung us out to dry yet.

There are other ways of standing up and being counted that armed marches and demonstrations in the streets.  I throw my backing in with the NRA.  They are not perfect, but they are the only ones, imo, that have the stroke to get anything done.   The NRA says armed guards and the POTUS responds.  He does not agree, but he responds.  They have the voice.  We should work to add ours to it.

Ugh... I hate breaking out the rules, but dammit we've got so few of them.  :ugh:   14 day vacation issued.  If he's lucky the rebellion won't happen while he's away, otherwise he might miss the whole thing.     TNGunOwners.com Forum Rules Revised December 7, 2011 1.) You are a guest here. All members are reminded that they are guests of the forum Owner and should conduct themselves accordingly. No one has a God-given right to be here and all members are expected to follow the rules of the house. This site is not run as a democracy and majority rule does not prevail. If you have a question about or disagree with an action taken by a moderator, discuss it with them in private. Do not debate them in public. If you do not like the answer that you receive, feel free to contact the Owner or an Administrator. Anyone who engages in insubordinate behavior will be removed from the site without question.

I suspect these White House petitions carry about as much weight as a SurveyMonkey.com petition would.

Well, actually, EVERY Marine is the wrong Marine for a burglar to mess with!   From the article:   In the official report from the Spokane County Sheriff's Office, [Marine Corporal] Pohle was said to have "escorted [burglar] Schwanke to the ground."   and:   Having just finished a seven-month combat tour in Afghanistan, Pohle said that his training just kicked in the second he saw the threat in his family's home. "When I took him to the ground, it kinda kicked in … to put him in a headlock and blood choke and I put my knee on his head, everything kicked in," he said.     http://www.kxly.com/news/spokane-news/Burglar-messes-with-the-wrong-Marine/-/101214/17938686/-/3u6b1sz/-/index.html?source=kxly   Firearms related story as every Marine is a Rifleman.

I always liked the brunette with the short hair. (Victoria?) I'm a bald guy with a hair fetish and that short brunette hair trips my trigger.

I always wanted to be the meat in a Sporty/ Ginger sandwich.

  The intent is there. She actually did us a favor. She went WAY to far.

    Geez louise. I will not comply. The issue is my AR-15, and We the People is my belief system. I am not going to display this to threaten some poor Libtard that's threatening me with "his" hired guns. I'm not going to display it to influence any outcomes. I will not comply. This is where I stand. I may (legally) sell my guns in the parking lot of the Pleasantville Walmart, or bury them in the back yard. I probably won't sell them to thugs like our government did, but...   If you are so hell bent on turning me into a criminal, then FUCK YOU, let's get to it. I WON'T comply with your destruction of the second amendment.   I haven't posted this anywhere. I won't until it's time. In fact, since it's copyrighted, I may not use it at all.   I won't comply. Don't give a rat's ass what anybody thinks about it.

Eh, I could have closed the thread but I'm seriously just not a fan of closing threads or heavy-handed moderation. Sooner or later we'll all get bored with this thread and move on to something else. Until then, it can entertain us...

Shouldn't EVERY day be come and take them day? Why give 364 other days where you don't yell the same thing?

  "America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system, but too early to shoot the bastards." – Claire Wolfe, 101 Things to Do 'Til the Revolution (1996)     I would say that Claire was mostly right, but that it's almost too late to work within the system rather than absolutely too late.  The work will be harder now, for sure, but there's still a chance that things can be turned around.

I got my oldest daughter her 1st gun for Christmas this year. She started asking for a gun of her own over the summer when I let her(with my help and careful instruction) shoot for the first time. It's not pink, but she wasn't asking for pink. She wanted bright yellow and that's exactly what she got. I thought she was a little young for a 22 but I came across one from a friend for about $10 more than I was going to pay for a bb gun and got it for her anyway. She has blasted several balloons so far with 22lr shot shells and has told everybody about it. She was even nice enough to let her little sister give it a try today. (Her sister is 3) She is only 5 but has been watching me clean, handle, carry, and shoot guns since she was old enough to see, and I have taken the time to patiently answer and show her anything about guns that she has ever asked. I even take her and her little sister squirrel hunting and and let them help me sort and deprime cases, but I'm always careful not to over do it. I let them decide when they are ready to quit and do something else. Guns are not taboo in my house, but are respected and enjoyed by my family, including my wife who enjoys shooting and hunting with her friends and me. I hope eventually they will be as into guns, hunting, and shooting as I am.

Those SC guys have been creeping in here for the past few months. Some of our members are taking the bait hook, line and sinker. It's one of the reasons that I participate less. I now sit back, read and wonder how far it's going to go. Good job David!

It looks like he did tell you why he locked it:     It appears that he was stopping the conversation before it went too far down a road that didn't need to be traveled.  It's his forum, thus his rules, and I understand his point.

Hell, yes! She was always my favorite.

How did this even come up?

Did hear for a role call of :RedNecks with RED hair"?

all things being equal getting the Marlin seems like a no brainer.     AK's and variants are stupid priced right now, only a moron would buy in such a sellers market.

I love my .357 lever action. It's lightweight, handles great, and if you reload you can tailor some .357 rounds specifically for the rifle to get a little more power. Like the others have said, black rifles are bringing a premium right now so you just might find a .357 lever for a reasonable price and buy the semi auto in a couple of months when things calm down and panic buyers start getting their credit card bills.  :popcorn:

dont know ask for me when you go in

In any case this is what I have to say to any new laws, regulation, or legislation:

They are very nice. Just out of curiousity, have you ever thought about doing a polo or knit shirt with a logo? Example: I know they would be a lot more expensive, but not everyone is a t-shirt guy. Not making a request, just asking.

I don't want to see anything pass.  Even the Gunshow loophole is sacred with me.  They can kiss my butt!

Now way in hell I want to be anywear near that demonstration. I spend too much time a the range watching nitwits mishandle their firearms in a "safe situation".

The only thing that's polling high is the "gun show loophole". Don't mean to be selfish here, but I just don't care if they pass that one and leave everything else alone.   Feinstein is doing this because she can, just like in '94. A LOT of folks lost their seats, but not that old blister. She's the queen of commies, representing like minded idiots.

Guys, he is from Aspen. People in Aspen are not representaative most of them are imigrants from California. Aspen is LA, Hollywierd east. I used to live in Colorado and the few times I visited Aspen it was was just strange. All you see in driveways and parking lots are Range Rovers, Mercedes and Porshes. True Story I had a frined that would glo every year after the end of ski season just to dumspter dive. The rich people would throw away big screen TV's and other high end electronics just because they had rented a house all winter and did not want to take things home.

They used to say that about guys that drove Vettes. I would have to prove them wrong. Not only would they be stuck driving their POS, but they would lose their girlfriend also.

  You new around here? :rofl:   Fact is, the devil is in the details, as usual. Last time you hit somebody in the mouth with your fist, there was a list of things that pushed you into that decision. Conquences were part of it, but they didn't outweigh the desire to hear and feel that impact :). We can discuss this all day long. When it comes down to it, we're only guessing.

There are good shops out there... I believe in the 'free' market, but I also hope everyone will also REMEMBER who's been totally and obviously GOUGING out there...during this time... D&T's been my LBS in this area good folks....

I think the problem is they've banned all forums greater than 10 posts ... taking some time for the ATF to process the paperwork to approve and register anything with more posts

 Cylons. . . . and they look like US!!

I despise talking on a phone, can't tell you why I just don't like it.  After living in an area where my phone did not work at home, work, or in between I quit carrying a cell phone.  Now that I'm living back in civilization I still don't have one, nor do I plan to get one.  As necessary I do have a Straighttalk phone that I activate as needed for trips and stuff.  It just wouldn't bother me if my phone didn't work in a certain location.  You always have the option not to patronize that place if you don't like it.  I know that a phone can be a great tool, nothing against people that carry them.  Coming unplugged has made my life a lot simpler though. 

Yep. I carried IWB for a long time until I realized that no one is going to notice me carrying, and if they did I guess I didn't care. The only time I IWB carry now is if I'm going somewhere that I don't want people to notice. OWB is where it's at for everyday stuff.

I have a relative buried at Arlington, so I did not really appreciate that, but you did not know that, so no harm.   The reason to stick to conventional political means is simple.  The conventional political battle is not over yet.  There is currently no EBR or normal capacity ban in effect and no guarantee that there will be in 2013 or 3013.   The political means are not yet exhausted.  Once they are the situation will be different, but for now there is no reason to sabotage this battle by starting another one.  This is only my opinion, so organize whatever you want, and march or stand wherever you want.

No, I would have responded that way regardless of the times. The individual making the comment was being disingenuous or purposefully ignorant. Either way, to suggest that having commo does nothing in the realm of saving someone's life is incredibly stupid. If that were the case we wouldn't have 911, ambulances or fire trucks. What would be the point if you couldn't get a hold of them. Just plain stupid.

All lined up to see who can smell the fart first.

I  aways love it when people come on here and make demands of the guy that keeps this place up and running. Amazing. Don't like the way something went down here? Simple, don't come back. Either way, it does seem you already got an explanation. 

Thanks to all who gave myself and my boys a great history lesson today. We were even taught how to load and fire a 3" CIVIL War Cannon.

    [Liam Neeson voice ON] But a bunch of cranky old gun nuts with a very particular set of skills; skills we have acquired over a very long career. Skills that make us a nightmare for people like you. [Liam Neeson voice OFF]

I doubt very many people are getting “racked” into buy a $5K 1911. I would have to laugh out loud if someone priced a 1911 to me at $5K. But I guess if you have $5K to blow, and you think spending $5K will make you a better shot than spending 1K on a 1911, that is certainly your right…. isn’t it?   Range memberships are simple math. Look at the “walk on” price multiplied by how many times a year you would use it and you have your answer. The math doesn’t work for me so I don’t have a membership, but I’m sure it works for the shooters that say they shoot twice a week.   Also, if someone can justify the cost of a membership, their yearly ammo cost has to be staggering in comparison to the range fees.   We all have choices. I can go to Terry Waldens outdoor range for $5 a day (someone said it has went up to $10), if I want to shoot indoors I can go to On-Target and pay $20 a day, or if I want a longer, better lit range I can go to Nashville Armory and pay $20 an hour.  Those are my choices. I usually shoot outside, I have shot at indoor ranges, but I’ll never pay $20 an hour. I am not the clientele they are looking for at their range, but I have bought a gun from them.   You are right, shooting should be affordable. It should also be affordable for a kid to go to a football game; but unfortunately due to greed in both industries nether are.

[quote name="piercedan" post="870460" timestamp="1356709385"]$400 means exclusivity.  It is all about the clientele you are fishing for.  The Charlie Haffner range is the best deal around here IMO but it can really pack out.  If you have a range and want to bring in only people of a certain affluence, then you charge more.  This is your filter and it keeps the range less crowded.  400 bucks is too rich for my blood for a range membership, but I have a buddy who would drop that without a second thought just for the exclusivity.[/quote] Not to mention the super cool lounge area and central heat and air. I love Charlie. He's a dear friend and I will never stop shooting there but it gets colder than a well diggers butt some days. He's done so much over what the Owl Hollow crew did. Bless him.

$400 means exclusivity.  It is all about the clientele you are fishing for.  The Charlie Haffner range is the best deal around here IMO but it can really pack out.  If you have a range and want to bring in only people of a certain affluence, then you charge more.  This is your filter and it keeps the range less crowded.  400 bucks is too rich for my blood for a range membership, but I have a buddy who would drop that without a second thought just for the exclusivity.

It sounds to me like you should take out the necessary loan to open your own shooting range and then price the memberships however you see fit.

look for a s&w j-frame and/or ruger wheel gun.