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It wasn't that long ago that it was unheard of for blacks to vote... or women.  We need less government, not more of it.  Let the churches decide who they will or won't marry.

How about we get the government out of everyone's marriage - gay and straight.  Seriously.  Make them all civil unions, and if there are benefits to be had, then extend them to everyone.   If you then want the church to recognize your relationship, and want a ceremony in a church - then find one that echoes your beliefs and get them to perform one for you.   Even as a Christian, I just don't get it. I don't particularly agree with the homosexual lifestyle, but it's not like the sin they bring to the table is somehow greater than the sin that I bring to the table.  And, from a "who is my neighbor" perspective, I just don't understand how you keep someone out of a hospital room or whatever in a time of need.    Power is terribly corrupting, but I'm wary of the end result when we as the church try to use the government(Babylon, if you will) as a weapon to do our bidding.

You know there's a simple way to shut BOTH sides up on the matter. Remove all tax credits for marriage. Say to the masses 'We don't care who you marry, it won't save you any money.' Both sides will be pissed but they will stop the bulk of their bickering amongst themselves. Everything boils down to money. America has proven the principle takes a back seat to cash every time. If NO one got a tax beak for being married, fewer would do so all around. The pot would boil for a little while longer then it would fizzle out and people would move on.

Well, I don't think that gay marriage will make anyone gay, so I'm not convinced that if it was recognized in TN it would force anything on anyone.  However, I do disagree with the notion of outsiders attempting to change our laws.   I dunno, whenever this comes up I get so pissy because I think the arguments on both sides are rediculous.  The notion that the worth of a person's marriage is whether or not the government properly defines their version of marriage still makes no sense.  The goverment could declare my marriage invalid tomorrow.  That won't change what I have with my wife.  The government could recognize a legal union between a man and his goat as equal to the one I have with my wife and it still won't change my marriage.  Gay marriage is nothing more than a tennis ball you distract your dog with while the neighbor's cat passes through your yard.

As to the bigger question of gay marriage.  I simply don't care that much what 'Babylon' chooses to recognize or not recognize.  It doesn't much affect me or the way we raise our family.    That said, I think there's a really important facet of this discussion that is conveniently left out because we would rather use the government as a hammer to mandate our way of thinking as opposed to having to think through the issue on our own.  Mind you, these comments while applicable to anyone, are mostly aimed at my fellow "church-going Americans".   It's easy to talk about "getting out the vote".  It's hard to see that, that person isn't really the boogeyman.   It's easy to talk about "marriage" being between a man and a woman.  It's harder to see that from a tax perspective you and your spouse who are married and file jointly are in fact a special class. And you willingly accept a bunch of other benefits from it, too.   It's easy to be dismissive about "Adam and Steve", and as Christians, fail to see those people as children of God.   It's easy to talk about "condoning deviant behaviors" while failing, again as Christians to see that their sins don't get them any further from God than yours or mine do.   It's very easy to use "holy" sounding language when in reality we dismiss the example of Jesus and how he would treat these people.   Like I said, I don't much care what the government says about this.  I do know how I'll talk to my children about it.  I hope that my example trends towards compassion.

From my perspective, if you want to keep the government out of your own personal life - and I do, then you don't have a lot of standing to demand the government keep someone else from doing something in their own private life.    This is dangerous.  I find it kind of ironic, really.  The problem with the "moral majority" type view of using the power of the government to extend your influence is that you're trying to use what will always be a corrupt institution to do your bidding. And yet, you're naïve enough or stupid enough to believe that corruption won't rub off on you.   The government doesn't have a bit of bearing on how I worship, and frankly they wouldn't have much bearing even if they told me I can no longer worship. I already see myself as sort of an exile - there's nothing the government is going to do to change that.    The power structure that is our government isn't going to change.  I'm wary of anyone who thinks they can change it, or even influence it.  More often than not, it seems that the reverse happens and the power ends up influencing them instead.  Not to mention, the simple question that's happening today - what happens when your "majority" loses it's strength?  It shouldn't surprise you to see all of those structures of power that you've worked so hard to build turned against you.

There was a time when we needed to have folks get married and have kids - to grow our country and economy.  It also re-inforced our culture -largely of single-marriage, 2-4 kid, working class families.  Thus the tax credit made sense.   I don't know enough to say whether it should be removed or not.   As far as marriage.  hmm.   I was a pastor for years, and was a Christian for many more years.  As most people see it, I am neither now.  So, as someone who has "been on the inside" - who was a conservative evangelical - who's world-view was formed by - and who's life was given over to Christian mission, and who is sympathetic to the many, many Christian loved ones and friends with whom I share life, this is my perspective:   This whole issue is a case of the church pointing a gun at her foot and pulling the trigger.  Society evolves (I know, bad word).  We are creatures of progress - thus the reason that we are not still living in caves with pointy sticks.  Women's rights (as they have differed from men's .. ie. the recognized rights of the powerless vs the recognized rights of those who held power) over time is an easy way to view this change.  Most of us now would say that any culture that deprives women of basic rights is a barbaric culture.        At some point in the not-to-distant past, conservative religious types saw the writing on the wall and knew that this (marriage equality) fight was coming to a national stage to stay.  If,... if at that point they had said,      "Hey... we're for separation of church and state, and we realize that we are not the only people group in our country or in the world.  So, we would like to keep the name "marriage" exclusive to the church - as it has great religious significance to us.  In order to do that, how can we help you (those who do would like to be legally recognized as a family unit) be treated fairly by the government - which should be impartial to us all?"       ... if the church had done that, conservative politics might be in a very different state... many middlers .. and even fiscally conservative democrats (want-to-be republicans who are incompatible with bigotry), would most likely be republicans, and 2012 would've looked much different.  - With that said, I do understand that uber-conservatives who's values are inextricably tied to their reilgious convictions would probably have jumped ship at that point - which is sad,..   and here is why....       -Do you remember "Where The Red Fern Grows"?  How you catch your first raccoon to train your hound?   .. Billy puts a shiny piece of metal in a log with a small hole.  (I know we all know this story)  The raccoon grabs the shiny metal and will not let go of it.  This results in dead raccoon.   (you can do the same thing with some monkeys - termite holes, and fruit)  The conservative/religious tie in this country is a lot like that raccoon and that shiny piece of metal.  Great conviction without long-term strategy... and no willingness to give up an inch in order to take a mile later.  Short-sightedness and emotional obsessing (I want it all... now!) is killing conservsative politics in our country.     Culture progresses; it's what we do.  Denying that is,... well...good luck.   If you find yourself wanting to kick that comment, just take a good, honest look at human history - the good and the bad... choose any specific culture, Christianity included... tell me progress is bad (David, Solomon?... where do you think all of Solomon's wealth came from?... do you think fairies mined the gold?  nope.. slaves.. with a horrific living situation and a short life span...Catholic church in the middle-ages anyone?  Luther?).  Progress is what we do, and in the moment - being trapped in the present (and formed by the past), we are mostly ill-suited to judge progress.  Managing (instead of trying to deny it), might be a better policy.    "Conservative" as an absolute is not functional in governance.  It's a non-starter for beings that are naturally progressive (intellectually and emotionally) - the results of which we are obviously seeing.  "Conservative" and "Liberal" are meant to indicate the rate of progress - not "for or against" progress.  With my view being that conservatives do their best to match the pace of (policy) progress at or just below the speed of cultural and economic progress.  Liberals tend to want to drive the progress through policy.  I am of the opinion that this is an important distinction that the american public needs to know in order to understand and steward our government.    When conservatives stopped managing progress and started trying to deny it (ie. "drive progress backwards through policy), they were grabbing on tight to that shiny piece of metal in the log, and they are now getting bludgeoned  to death. - because they are working against human nature - in doing this, they come off as uncaring of others... thus they are loosing emotional and intellectual connection with the population.  No amount of conviction will make up for that, and over the long haul, people groups will give in to emotional comfort over logic... thus the way policy is pushed through media these days.   Serparation of church and state is a good thing.  Adults treating other adults like adults is a good thing.     Adults (in power) failing to treat other adults (subjects) as adults -throw in taxes... seems to me I remember something about that in a history book.

Call me an absolutist if you want, but I can't get past the "shall not be infringed" part that follows "the right to keep and bear arms".

*Tangent Rant* ...though still relevant. Before our founding fathers ever inked a single document, they had a very simple idea. That idea works as long as you stick to it very closely. That idea is: You are free to do ANYTHING you want so long as what you are doing does not infringe on the right of someone else to do what they want. This plays right into state rights and why we MUST defend state rights vehemently. As people populate and spread they will naturally segregate themselves. People tend to live with their own class and kind of people. It's not some racist BS they now try to indoctrinate us with. It's only natural and its by and large a good thing. Well, that makes the separation of different states very handy. If you like a certain lifestyle or certain whatever, live in a state where that thing is legal and welcome. If you hate a certain thing then live in a state where that sort of thing is illegal and frowned upon. DON'T move to a state and demand they conform to YOU. That's BS. The beauty part of the Union being, and what would set us apart from Europe is that you are free to move where ever you darn well please without papers or persecution. The ONLY role the federal government should play in this country is to mediate interstate disputes and protect the union from outside threat. NOTHING else. Piss on this socialist nanny state we have become. I'd give much to see this malignant tumor surgically removed. This system works near perfectly. Why the hell can't people get that in their thick heads!!!?!?!?

To say that marriage is a religious matter is to also say that one must be religious in order to participate. Under that philosophy we are talking about something much larger than simply gay marriage. We are now talking about religion dominating our laws. I don't want to live in a country like that. I've spent many years of my adult life in countries where religion dictates law. Not a good thing, no matter how much you may or may not agree with the religion in power.

Subject: Prison release You might recall that John Hinckley was a seriously deranged young man who shot President Reagan in 1981. Hinckley was absolutely obsessed with movie star Jodie Foster and, in his twisted mind, loved Jodie to the point that to make himself well known to her, he attempted to assassinate President Reagan. There is speculation Hinckley may soon be released as having been rehabilitated. Consequently, you will appreciate the following letter from Nancy Reagan to John Hinckley. We could all learn so much from this elegant and gracious lady: To: John Hinckley From: Mrs. Nancy Reagan My family and I wanted to drop you a short note to tell you how pleased we are with the great strides you are making in your recovery. In our country's spirit of understanding and forgiveness, we want you to know that we bear no grudge against you for shooting Ronnie. We are fully aware that mental stress and pain could have driven you to such an act of desperation. We're confident that you will soon make a complete recovery and return to your family to join the world again as a healthy and productive man. Best wishes, Nancy Reagan & Family P.S. While you have been incarcerated, Barack Obama has been banging Jodie Foster like a screen door in a tornado. You might want to look into that

  I guess it's a good thing that every kid in America has a good heterosexual home to go to where they are never abused and live without fear.  This is the US, I can't imagine there will ever be a need for a loving home for some kid who could give a #### if their parents are gay or not.    

 DEAR > > DIARY - DAY 1 > > All > > packed for the cruise ship -- all my nicest dresses, > > swimsuits, short sets. Really, really exciting. > > Our > > local Red Hat chapter - The Late Bloomers decided on this > > "all-girls" trip. > > It > > will be my first one, - and I can't wait!   > > DEAR > > DIARY - DAY 2 > > > > Entire day at sea, beautiful. Saw whales and dolphins. Met > > the Captain today -- seems like a very nice man. > > DEAR > > DIARY - DAY 3   > > At the pool today. Did some shuffleboard, hit golf balls off > > the deck. Captain invited me to join him at his table for > > dinner. Felt honored and had a wonderful time. He is very > > attractive and attentive.   > > DEAR > > DIARY - DAY 4   > > Won > > $800.00 in the ship's casino. Captain asked me to have > > dinner with him in his own cabin. Had a scrumptious meal > > complete with caviar and champagne. He asked me to stay the > > night, but I declined. Told him I could not be unfaithful to > > my husband.   > > DEAR > > DIARY - DAY 5   > > Pool again today. Got sunburned, and I went inside to drink > > at piano-bar, stayed there for rest of day. Captain saw me, > > bought me several large drinks. > > > > Really is quite charming. Again asked me to visit his cabin > > for the night. Again I declined. He told me, if I did not > > let him have his way with me, he would sink the ship... I > > was shocked. > > DEAR > > DIARY - DAY 6   > > Today I saved 2600 lives.   > > Twice.  

  Like watching an Obama speech in person :)

This is one of the anchors at Fox News giving Obama up the road and I love it.....     http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XDIvkJqLwU

I don't care where the concept came from, it's irrelevant when it comes to making laws. I don't care if a person marries his lawnmower. It's none of my damn business. It's none of your damn business. It sure as hell is none of the government's business. We DO NOT live in a theocracy.

Those chicks don't shave, Mac. That's some legislation that I'm just not going to be able to support.

Seen this quite funny. Good points if you like him or not. Some crude language it was censored when it played just be fore warned. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=2Qtx_ZcHOjw  

  Ding! And, we have a winner

How about this. We get together and I fix it for you. I can solve the problem in about 10 minutes or have it figured out..

 The way the U.S. Gov. treated the Native Americans was/is disgraceful. In all fairness tho, they treat the  rest of the population the same way.

pics or it didn't happen... :stir:

Yes! I don't like mo's but I don't have the right (no one else does either) to tell them what they can and can't do as long as they ain't hurting anyone. If churches oppose it, then oppose it within walls of their synagogue. People have to remember, the very thing that protects their choice of lifestyle, also protects YOURS. Provided no one is being hurt, abused or exploited, people HAVE to be free to live as they choose. I despise whores and lifestyles that support that kind of thing, but the very thing that protects evangelists bible thumping is what protects Larry Flint. True freedom is a very difficult balancing act. Sadly, the scales have been unbalanced in this country for a many, MANY years. It's unclear to me if they ever really were.

I was on Ritalin as a child from K-3rd grade when my parents decided that the school could go eff itself. It was the school folks that initially suggested ADHD testing and then pressured my parents to have me put on Ritalin. That crap is evil. The first teacher or school administrator to broach the subject with me regarding my daughter and/or any other children we may have will get a firm and not so polite warning to never speak of it again. The next one will get knocked the fuck out.

I make no claims to be a prophet but I've been saying this for the last decade. ....all the while ferreting away my lead stores.

    Is purchasing lead from them still an available option Gordon? Or have they already shut down folks?   You know, Ross Perot warned us of this type of thing many years ago. NAFTA, CAFTA, and GAT...but I didn't see this particular route of loosing our manufacturing base in the U.S.A. We're in trouble folks.(understatement intentional). :2cents:

WOW! A Bullpup 338. Mile long shots from the front seat of your truck :)

Locked in a trailer is as secure as locked in my house or my car. I think it’s ridiculous that anyone would even imply they have a responsibility to better secure ammo from burglars.   No 3500 is not a lot.   The driver of the vehicle was an 18 year old adult; the two with him were 15 and 16. I hope they are all headed for prison or reform school; they are burglars.   Why is it a story? Because someone is trying to make it look like LEO’s made it easy for kids to get ammo; which is nothing close to what happened.

Check PSA site daily.

Final tally looks like 166 lowers, 119 uppers and 66 BCGs.  121 total participants.

This bobcat watched the hunter gut the deer and then came right up to have a snack.   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u65rvJfc6iM   Was either very hungry or one of the mildest tempered bobcats I have seen.

I have bought quite a bunch knives over the last couple of years, and quite a few have been fairly expensive. While I have enjoyed having, using/abusing, and in some cases, giving away my knives, things change. Interests, priorities, and even relationships change over time. I have been a fan of Rick Hinderer's XM line for quite a while, and my XM-24 is one of my favorite blades. The downside to Rick's knives has always been their popularity and the price they command on the secondary market, which is no fault of Rick; he makes a great product. Anyway, a friend of mine at USN, got on one of Hinderer's Friday specials where they were selling 15 XM-18s at normal cost. He knew I didn't have one, and he got one for me. While I wasn't really looking for a new XM, I jumped all over this one since it was at normal cost. It is nothing special, but here is my XM-18 (bottom), which will be the last knife I buy for quite some time.

Well that is where you're wrong. When it comes to the government the only beliefs I have revolve around liberty. I am not an advocate of gay marriage, I'm an advocate of small government and people not using that government as an action arm to push their religious beliefs on others. Liberty is my only motivation when it comes to deciding policies of our government. Your motivations are obviously religious. That has no place in deciding policy outside the walls of your church.

I think you miss the point. We need to live under the laws of the religion I believe in, as all the others are illegitimate. Once you're forced to live in a theocracy that mirrors my faith then things will get better. All other faiths be damned, they're all wrong anyway. Could someone do some research and actually look up the word "liberty" in Websters? For crying out loud, we're simply talking about the government's opinion on marriage. Why on earth would anyone care, gay or straight, what a bunch of corrupt politicians think about their marriage? I just don't get it.

The Titans came into Nashville and didn't bring any good to the city folks taxes went up to pay for a stadium that Bud should had paid for and really the team what had one good year the entire time here. sent from RAZR Maxx HD using Tapatalk Pro

If you look at it from that perspective, I think we've still got a problem - namely that we keep swinging at every pitch. There are real problems out there. Ones that really matter. This isn't one of those, really. But, look at our dialog at the national level. Conservatives are losing traction by spending so many cycles on this instead of talking about the larger issues. Party platforms are being dictated by these tiny "constituencies" that are in reality the people who donate to campaigns and show up to vote in primaries. Couple that with the fact that most folks in the "middle" simply don't care one way or another, and that puts us in a really dangerous place. Add in the fact that the GOP has successfully gerrymandered a lot of these districts to the point that the DNC couldn't rig an election to win in most of them, and you find out that what might seem like a good thing is in fact a bad one. These politicians in these districts, bought by their "constituency" with their moral agenda have zero incentive to negotiate, much less compromise. Their constituents might in fact prefer them walk this whole thing off the cliff. I hope they don't get the chance, but in the meantime I wish we'd keep from getting all lathered up every time they mention it and instead talk about problems that really matter. Oh. Except this is convenient for the GOP leadership, too. Maybe if we keep everybody spun up about this they won't realize we don't have a clue how to address $16 trillion dollars in debt or the stomach to actually make any of the hard choices it'll take to get there.

I like that first one the best.  The blade shape looks good and the color/pattern of the wood is interesting.

  The issue is that there should be no definition of marriage at the State or Federal level.  There are benefits directly tied to marriage.  Change the State and Federal code to only recognize civil unions and link all benefits to a civil union, then it won't be an issue.  Marriage is a religious term that was adopted before this all was an issue.  Either leave it as Marriage and allow gays to "Marry" or change it to Civil Union and make everyone have a Civil Union to be recognized by the State and Federal Governments.  If you want to be "Married", go to a church.   But I suspect that won't be good enough for Religious folks either as that would be an assault on religion??

I don't disagree with this at all. It was the introduction of a more clearly defined and structured environment that actually started to help me with my behavioral issues. The Ritalin just masked them by turning me into a doped up zombie. I would say that even including the kids that have a real, definable issue like I did (there were 3 days of inpatient testing involved in my diagnosis) the vast majority can be better helped with consistent structure and discipline than with the drugs. The drugs hide the underlying issues so the parents and other parties don't have to deal with them.

TMF:  I pretty much agree with your assessment RE "shiftin blame and shirking of individual responsibility"; its one of my great concerns with society as a whole... All that bein said; i always look for a "drug connection" with these young (...14 yr old, i think...) perpetrators...  Your point is well taken and very revellant... The drug thing shows up way too frequently to suit me... I'll agree that ya can make a case for poor parenting and/or individual "bad behavior"  and idiotic society being the catalyst for this kind of bad behavior.... I think that ya can also have a corollary of that that says "...I dont want to be bothered with this brat at the school and parent level, therefore, ill give him drugs..."; and that's what society has done in many cases....   I fully agree that the individual is responsible for his, her or it's behavior; i do believe, however that there are some enablers out there that are causin trouble where none should exist and that these actions are being covered up... I know that no one likes to hear about the "good ole days"; but i never remember a juvenile shooting anyone else in school makin the news before the seventies.... Remember the "drug culture" started in the early sixities... I think that is significant...If i remember right, this kid wuz an 8 th grader; or about 14 years old... I'm willin to bet there is a drug connection... We can quibble about the individual responsibility thing here; but this one smells rotten to me... If i remember right; the kid that did the shootin in kentucky wuz a ridlin user...   leroy

http://www.zachsgunbelts.com/index.html Video review http://youtu.be/RMU8KOf_1GE

My question would be has the kid that done the shooting been takin Ridlin or one of its brothers prescribed to calm down hyperactivity...   No one seems to want to talk about that one; but i think (...as some others do....) that it's a real problem that aint gonna be fixed; because it implicates the medical, physiological, pharmaceutical, and education enterprises equally......   Food for thought... leroy

I do not thing that will fly in the SCOTUS.

I'm thinking CMT gave us a really good price because they love TGO. Not sure they made a pile of money on this deal. WE, on the other hand, got the best price on billet receivers we're ever gonna see. That's why I ordered my limit.

[quote name="TMF" post="1051970" timestamp="1382412070"] I didn't know there was a wrong way unless you're pointing it at someone.[/quote] I'm a AK guy and was unfamiliar with the hold button on the left side and pull charging handle maneuver on a AR platform to hold the bolt open. I asked the honest question on how to do it here to find out how to hold the bolt open and got ripped up saying I should know how to work any gun I own. Should have just Googled it but I guess I needed to learn more about the human race that day. I was still new at the AR platform and was trying to be a good gun owner and ask a safety question to more experienced owners and got beat down for not just trying to figure it out and wanting to ask. The good thing is that it taught me a lesson, I now declare to anyone I take shooting with any of my guns to ask me any thing they want to know on how to use them cause I'd rather them be safe. My number one rule out there is, there is no stupid or embarrassing questions on guns.

Might make for a good discussion starter for one of my criminal justice classes.

Something we all need to be reminded of from time to time in regards to a hand gun carry permit 1) in a life or death situation when we pull our hand gun we must be willing to shoot and 2) if we feel we must shoot we shoot until the threat is stopped. if any doubt about this we probably don't need a handgun carry permit.

That's dedication. On your part for your dog. On his part for carrying.

  Whoosh.   1. "marshall" is misspelled. 2. and the actual term is "martial".   - OS

So we box em up send em to SA and wait till the Croatian wizards come up with a plan. Will be my last Springfield too...was fun while it lasted, even when learning to hold it with authority.... I really do love my 45 but I want it on my side not on a shelf.....bastards.... Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2 of course it ate my spelling.