Leaderboard

The better you can shoot.... the better you can shoot. Period. Even under stress. And it seems that those who start out at a high level seem to do just fine. If you start out at the top of the mountain and tumble down 25% of the way you are still pretty high up that mountain. If you start out only 25% of the way up the mountain and you fall 25% of the way down under stress then you are now in a heap at the bottom. If you can draw and shoot a 3 shot 4" group at 7 yards in 2 seconds and you suffer a 25% reduction in ability due to stress then that is now a 5" group in 2.5 seconds. If you can only do it in 4 seconds that is now a 5" group in 5 seconds. (This is not directed at any individual in this thread) What annoys me is when people who can't shoot well by virtually any metric work in the training industry and take money from people and tell them that as long as they hit the target (generally the size of a king size bed sheet) any where then that is good for you and bad for them. And they use that as a justification for sloppy marksmanship. And they refer to vague "pearls of wisdom" like "you won't be able to see your sights in a gunfight" that was wisdom from a time when sights on "combat pistols" were largely tiny little nubs compared to the sights we have today. Look at the sights on a 1911 built in 1920 or even a 1911A1 made in 1943 vs a modern one made by Springfield or Wilson or virtually any other manufacturer. But the "instructor" is still telling people that you won't be able to see them and therefore they damn the student to not using their sights under stress for lack of even trying to look for them. Self fulfilling prophecy. Garbage in garbage out. Unfortunately there are too many people hanging up a shingle and calling themselves instructors that don't have a good enough contextual and historical body of knowledge to know that what they are saying might not apply today or WHY it might not apply. And frankly too many of them don't shoot at a level to have any idea of what actually is possible and what is not. On the other hand there are plenty of folks (Cirillo and Bill Allard, Charles Askins,Wyatt Earp,John Wesley Hardin etc etc) who saw sights and used them and won a bunch of gunfights. Why? Because they LOOKED for them. The interesting thing is that all those guys could shoot well....hmm...maybe there is a cause and effect relationship ? Now I'm not saying you will ALWAYS have to see sights to hit a human in the upper chest . In fact I am a big proponent building a drawstroke and grip that drives the gun to where it needs to be whether you look at the sights or not and then using just enough visual verification to guarantee the hit and no more . Some shots are so easy that you can make them without focusing hard on the sights. Think about a shot on an aggressor 3 yards away. That is not a technically difficult shot to make and most people can make it from less than full extension. But If you spend all of your time on shooting fast garbage can lid sized groups at 3 yards and you are then confronted with a guy 10 yards away in a parking lot filled with a bunch of "organic backstop " (people) down range then suddenly things just got really dangerous for EVERYONE. AJ mentions the 4" group as fast as you can deliver it. (and the key here is to do it FAST). That is something to strive for in training and we understand that we might still end up with a 6" group at speed under stress. I personally want to keep it all in a 3" circle and work toward that (as fast as I can) so that if it is 4 or 5 under stress that is still adequate to hit them somewhere very close to the spot I was actually trying to hit. And we are trying to hit a SPOT. We are not just trying to hit the guy "somewhere...more times than not....most of the time". If your "acceptable standards" are high in training then your "stress degraded performance" is probably still higher than most people's "best case scenario performance" . (That last comment was an understatement ...there is a reason that the average police hit ratio is 25% and certain specialized units like LAPD SWAT and SIS (Special Investigation Service) is more like 95%. And it does not have anything to do with the gun in their holster. It has to do with their level of training and the standards they accept as "good enough". ) In the end we just do not know what the problem we face will be. It will PROBABLY be 3 or 4 yards but it could be 34 yards. Andy Brown shot Dean Mellberg from 75 yards away with a Beretta 92 to stop the Fairchild Air Force base shooting in 1994. He hit Mellberg in the head and right shoulder. Vic Stacy shot Charles Ronald Conner from 50 yards away with a revolver while Conner was trying to kill officer Steven Means in Early,Texas in 2012. He hit him 4 times. I'm guessing Brown and Stacy probably both saw their sights.......

Just a friendly regular reminder that time spent training with people like @Cruel Hand Luke who know what they’re doing is really worth it. Spending a day or two with some good folks, working on *correct* execution of drills you can bring home with you, and getting to put some rounds down range load testing your actual carry setup is so worth it. Really. Seriously. If you’ve never done it, take a defensive pistol course from a knowledgeable instructor. Randy is a great instructor, and we’re so thankful to have him on TGO. But he’s also a professional who has suggested good trainers in other areas to a whole bunch of folks over the years. Get some training. It’s worth it.

Fairly certain this was Hoss Cartright when he was a toddler.

Not sure if many of you know of this site, but it brings me a chuckle a day on the political front. I expect most here will agree. https://babylonbee.com/ Thought everyone could use a laugh in these crazy times. One of my favorites from the last couple of days as an example. https://babylonbee.com/news/bernie-sanders-confused-by-new-hampshire-state-motto-live-free-or-die--both-of-those-options-sound-horrible

Looks like a Blue Heeler with tags to me. https://www.dropbox.com/s/1tpws8kq2tdxu2g/IMG_2426.PNG?dl=0

+1 . I'd argue that fending off a guy who is armed with a knife while you are seated in the passenger seat of a car is pretty stressful yet once I got the gun out and created some space I saw the sights clearly because I LOOKED for the sights. I also took the time (less than a second) to scan the back ground for what was beyond the target in case of a shoot through or a miss. So when people try to tell me it CAN'T be done that just does not match my own experience. Incidentally I had that discussion about the incident and the scanning the background with a student one time. I told him about how fast things can be processed in your mind and it can look like other things and people are in slow motion. I related that I had the time to look at the back ground as I got the gun up and on the sights and that I still had enough dexterity to take up the slack on the trigger AND then let off the trigger without firing the gun once the threat decided that he really didn't want to get shot. I was able to do this without any spastic accidental jerking of the trigger. And that was with a 1911(So much for NEEDING a DA trigger to prevent ADs) And your hands do not ALWAYS turn to flippers during the incident. (Afterward the adrenaline dump did make my hands shake but not until after it was over). So now fast forward about 8 months and that same student who works as a bail bondsman gets into a gunfight while trying to take a bail jumper into custody. He told me that IN THE MOMENT he remembered what I had said and he actually LOOKED at the background (an urban parking lot feeding into a city street) as the gun was coming up out of his holster and BEFORE he pressed off the first shot. He said "It was just like you said" . He shot and hit the guy twice, the bad guy ran off and his lawyer negotiated his surrender to the police a couple of months later. Apparently one round hit the bad guy's gun and one hit him in the leather belt he was wearing and deflected off leaving 2 superficial arm and torso wounds (so much for pistols knocking people down) . Point is that we don't all experience exactly the same phenomena and we don't all react the same to it. You tend to do what you have practiced and planned for...

Here ya go.... (yes, spelled wrong on purpose).....

Exactly why I prefer the products from HangFast Targets that uses an angled mount on a common T-post. https://images.app.goo.gl/GbnbMEc4TVJMhRJDA

I have some experience with shooting steel. Yes, I know it can be dangerous so I want to set my gongs up where they will be as safe as possible. Thanks for the links, I have watched some of them. I like Hickock video on shooting steel. Hickock has a great place for steel targets because he shoots across a ravine which changes the angle of the ricochet up close, and his rifle targets are on the far side of the ravine. He stands above the close targets on his range. I can do that also, but my range is not on that steep of a grade and I will be standing on a large rock to raise the shooter up an additional 2 feet, thereby changing the angle also. My gongs will be hung on chains swinging with a slight downward angle also which will create a greater angle to deflect splatter and bullets down into the ground instead of back toward the shooter. Guys any time you shoot there is a danger of accident so I want to eliminate as much risk as possible. Again thanks for the posts and advice.

I enjoy those videos. "Although some people think... it's a floor wax and also a dessert topping..."

Come out to the TN/GA/AL Training day on FEB 22 and you will get a full day of it .......

. Irreconcilable differences- grounds for divorce....

In numerous high stress situations, I have been able to see my sights, unless one doesn't consider things like taking down a murder suspect as high stress. There's a lot of wisdom in the words of Jim Cirillo.

I finally received my Geissele Super Duty Upper that I ordered on Black Friday. So far I really like.

I just got back from a three day hunt in Canyon Texas for Sandhill Cranes. I bought this hunt at our local chapters SCI banquet. This was my first time hunting cranes and it was a blast. They call sandhill cranes the flying ribeye of the sky. I had heard so much about how great they are to eat that I was worried that it would not live up to hype. Our outfitter grilled us some breasts one night and let me say that it does live up to the hype. If you did not know you were eating crane you would think it was steak. We also had some spectacular sunrises and sunsets. I used Diamond Wing Outfitters. They were great. Worked hard to make sure we had opportunities to kill cranes. The limit is three per day. We had four hunters in our group. The first day we saw thousands of cranes but only killed 3. The second day we got 9 but should have limited out. They are a tough bird to bring down unless you get a clean head shot. The third day we got our limit. One afternoon we also got some duck hunting in. All in all it was a great trip. https://www.diamondwingoutfitters.com

Some of you have noticed I haven't been online much in January or February. It's been busy around the HQ, for sure. First and foremost, on January 31st my wife and I welcomed this little nugget into our lives... Our third child, and second daughter, arrived on the scene on the 31st at 8lbs 8oz and 20-inches long. She and mom have been doing well but the year ahead of us will be challenging. Three days after she was born we discovered that our daughter has a cleft soft pallet which was making it impossible for her to nurse easily either naturally or by bottle. We've been connected with some excellent doctors at VUMC Children's Hospital and they put us onto the trail of some bottles specifically designed for kids with this condition and they've made a tremendous difference. Unfortunately our daughter will need surgery to repair the cleft, but they want her to be at least 10-12 months old before they do it. Our objective in the meantime is to keep her on-target from nutrition and growth perspectives. But we really can't complain about any of this. All it takes is a quick walk through the Children's Hospital lobby to understand how fortunate we are in so many other ways. God's been good to us. As if that weren't enough excitement, last Saturday (08-FEB-2020) I injured myself coming down the stairs in the middle of the night. My eyes an brain got into a disagreement about which step I was on and I over-stepped the last one at the bottom and made contact with the floor about 10-inches later than I anticipated that I would. This was made more troubling by the fact that I was carrying our 2-year old. He's fine and was fine. I took the fall to both knees and plopped him safely onto the hardwood in front of me before I collapsed on my side in agony. I've essentially been living and sleeping in a recliner with my feet up since Saturday, I am able to walk on it just fine and have no pain from supporting or lifting my weight with that leg, but bending it hurts a bit and there's been an occasional mechanical popping sensation in it. Chances are it's a torn meniscus. I'm meeting an orthopedic surgeon tomorrow for an evaluation and consult. I am half expecting arthroscopic surgery to be necessary to trim or stitch the meniscus, but I am praying that it's not that and is just a strain/sprain that needs more time to heal up. Again, though... I'm blessed. My son wasn't hurt at all in that fall and it could have been a LOT worse for the both of us. And seriously, walk though VUMC sometime. It's a perspective changer. Anyway, the next bit will be busy for me and my family. If I am slow to respond to things here, give me a little extra time?

.

I’d probably choose the Charter Arms Pitbull. I’d pick the Ruger 10 times out of 10 over the Taurus. If you’ve not shot one yet, I’d probably encourage you to do so - and work through some combat reloads. I wouldn’t be surprised if the has an effect on your final decision.

TCA 55-4-110(a)!

Sure. And at that distance, the use of sights is now required. I would be switching from point instinct shooting to target shooting.

At that distance YOU may not be the immediate object of the attacker's attention. You might be engaging them to save someone else.

That's not what Cirillo himself wrote in his descriptions of the gunfights in which he was involved.

G96 does all. May taste good on peanut butter sammiches..

I'm no where close to being any color of authority on the platform, but I've built a couple of really low budget ARs (sub $400) & I've spent a pretty solid amount of range time behind some much higher end guns ($1000+) trying to figure out if it was worth it, to me, to invest the difference & buy a Barrett that I'd fallen in love with. Needless to say, I'm still shooting my $400 gun. Out to sensible .223/5.56 ranges (600yds) I could see absolutely no accuracy or reliability difference that made me want to spend the extra. The cynic in me is saying that, come October, I'm pretty sure my $400 gun is going to be worth a bit more, where a $1000 gun is still going to be a $1000 gun

But that is when it counts the most. That is why one should train and have these discussions.

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former.

I'd rather discuss the proper vs general populas usage of a term than the 2020 election. I'm so done with the with politics right now an RMR discussion is refreshing.

Untitled by Johnny Rotten, on Flickr

Sometimes I really hate being right when I make an assessment of things like this, but...

It's been interesting watching this group. The entire purpose of the group is to form a committee in each county and for that committee to advocate that their county become formally recognized as a sanctuary county. A few observations that I've made (thus far, I've only observed and have not participated in any discussions): - the group has drawn over 15k members in less than a month, supposedly all Tennesseans (impressive!) - as mentioned the purpose of the group is to increase the number of sanctuary counties. - people have an incredibly hard time staying on topic, many members seem to think that the purpose of the page is to overthrow the government. - the Fudds are very present. Reading through comments I just imagine that a good number of these people OC a Hi Point in a nylon holster. - looking at it from a pragmatic, unbiased position it seems that there is a minority of intelligent, professional people, setting out to obtain a goal in a logical fashion, while the majority of the group mass responds to an intelligent post with something of the likes of "I have an AR-15 that I'm dead accurate with at 100 yards and I'm not afraid to use it." It's been fun watching it play out.

One would think that but it is no longer a universal norm. Manufacturers have been cutting a lot of corners the past few years as in taper crimps on .38 specials. A fine example is all the cheap Federal 158gr LSWC that’s been available. A perfect round but most reports indicate it’s not crimped at all.

water. looks to me it is time for a new wife.

unless you drive a 3/4 ton or larger.

@dralarms is this you?

Fess up who is this Untitled by Johnny Rotten, on Flickr

A friend of mine used to carry in a belly band. He'd wear it high on his chest with the gun positioned under his left arm similar to a shoulder holster. He was also very fond of western style shirts with snaps instead of buttons. If needed he's just do the "Superman" thing and could access the gun quickly. BTW: his EDC was a 6" S&W Model 29. He was a big old barrel chested guy and if you didn't know it was there, you'd never spot that cannon.

Here is a link to a much better video of the one above from liveleak. The video above is from Youtube and they cut out the sound of the gun going off and his mother yelling at him. https://www.liveleak.com/view?t=unzdd_1581220111

sd582mvuvpb31 by Johnny Rotten, on Flickr

We’ll argue about anything here. Even when its meaningless. Having said that, the proper term is “Red Dot”. It’s not my problem if a user is confused on whether or not it’s a reflex, prismatic or holographic sights. If he needs to know or needs clarification; he can either do his research or ask. I use the term red dot when discussing these optics; so it must be right.